Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast: Making Art Work
Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast: Making Art Work
#304: Rebecca Driver (Founder of Rebecca Driver Media Relations (RDMR)) (pt. 2 of 2)
This week on the podcast is part one of interview with British entrepreneur, Rebecca Driver. She founded RDMR (Rebecca Driver Media Relations) in 2010 after having worked in classical music PR at Dvora Lewis PR, as publicist at the BBC Proms, BBC Radio 3, and Head of Press at the English National Opera.
Make sure you tune in to hear Rebecca's anecdotes and what she's learned over the years working with clients such as the Academy of St. Martin in the Fields and the Royal Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra. https://www.rdmr.co.uk/
Welcome to the Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast. Making art work. We highlight how entrepreneurs align their artistry, passion and vision to create and pursue opportunities to capture value in the arts. The views expressed by guests on the Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast are solely their own and do not necessarily represent the views of the podcast or its hosts. The appearance of a guest on the podcast, the venture they represent or reference to any product or service does not imply an endorsement or recommendation by the podcast or its hosts. The content provided is for entertainment and informational purposes only and does not constitute business advice. Here are your hosts Andy Heise and Nick Petrella.
Andy Heise:Hi Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast listeners. I'm Andy Heise and I'm Nick.
Nick Petrella:Petrella. Rebecca Driver is with us today. She's the founder and CEO of Rebecca Driver Media Relations. She founded RDMR in 2010 after working in classical music PR at Devorah Lewis PR, as publicist at the BBC Proms, bbc Radio 3, and head of press at the English National Opera. Rebecca studied music at Royal Holloway University of London and head of press at the English National Opera. Rebecca studied music at Royal Holloway University of London and she is also a trustee for the National Youth Choir. Make sure you visit her website in the show notes so you can learn more about her team and their list of clients that include the Academy of St Martin in the Fields and the Royal Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra. Thanks for being with us, rebecca.
Rebecca Driver:Such a pleasure to be here. Thanks for having me.
Andy Heise:I've thought about that before. It's like, you know, we for this podcast. As an example, we post a little soundbite on our, on our Instagram feed and you know, ultimately what we're asking people to do is listen to this 30 second snippet and then stop what you're doing and go listen to a 25 minute podcast. You know it's like that's, that's a lot, you know, especially in the on the social media format, right To get people's attention and then go to go read an in-depth article or a long form interview or something like that. That could be a real challenge, I would imagine.
Rebecca Driver:Yeah, definitely. And look, I think we're all time poor. It's a. It's a massive, massive thing. I think we're all time poor. It's a, it's a massive, massive thing. But you know, I do also think people do still want to read things and to look at things. But you know, I think, but there's just so much choice.
Announcer:So, yeah, you've got to be really grabbing.
Rebecca Driver:Yeah, you've got to be really grabbing and what you're doing. So I think that for me, is absolutely the most enormous shift that we've seen. But on top of that, I think there's been a huge squeeze in space generally as well. So you know, I think in the traditional media sense, you know, so much art stuff has been cut. You know newspapers have had an incredibly tough time. Ads are down, which is what, as we know, is the thing that sells them and makes them the money.
Rebecca Driver:Um, and you know, I think because of that you know, if I think about back to when I started, you know here in the UK, um, and look, you know we're in a better position than in America. Um, you know, here in the, what I'm saying will sound like I'm being really spoiled because we've got so much more than you guys have in the States. But you know, here it's also massively shrunk. But when I started, you know newspapers were doing so many more reviews of concerts. There were so many more features there were. You know it's massively reduced.
Rebecca Driver:If I look at somewhere like the Financial Times, which, of course, also has quite a strong readership in America, you know they were, they were doing so many reviews and they now do one classical review a week, you know, and it was probably one a day. Two a day, you know, is huge. So that's also a massive thing to contend with and I and I think, as a result, everything, um, you know, I, I say regularly that I reckon now we're having to work 30 harder for 30 less coverage, just because of the squeeze on space, but also the amount of great stuff that's going on, which is brilliant, you know right, and we had a music critic on a couple years ago and this has been paul horsley, remember, and this has been coming on with the letting reviews and critics go, yeah, from you know, but andy brought up absolutely yeah, andy brought up a good point, so to try and get people to do something.
Nick Petrella:So what are some successful campaigns or calls to action that you've either employed or have seen that have garnered some pretty positive results, in a way, to just be heard through social media?
Rebecca Driver:Through socials? Yeah, great question. So, I think, through socials. So we, interestingly, I think the classical sector specifically has situation a little, because people were forced to have to do things digitally because of the situation we were in. But of course, it's a really complex web, particularly when you get lots of musicians involved, because, of course, they need to be paid and so as soon as you've got an orchestra, for example, that can get pretty expensive. So, yeah, it's a challenging sphere with the rights around things, and one that you know it's absolutely important and absolutely necessary for musicians to be remunerated properly. But I think the pandemic meant that, because we were being forced to do things digitally and to record stuff and that was the only way that people could get access to things, it meant that that conversation progressed and so I think we we got better at getting those, you know, getting things resolved in and finding ways to do that, but in terms of a successful campaign.
Rebecca Driver:So I'm going to use the Benedetti Foundation as one of um, which was a uh, you know very much this is a pandemic story, but um, it was really powerful. So, um, nicola Benedetti, um, founded her foundation, um, back in 2019 and then the first kind of activity happened in at the start of 2020 and she does these amazing, um big, uh, benedetti sessions, which are all about mass music making for musicians of all ages and stages. Um, so, from little, really tiny, wee ones to, you know, uh, university, um, kind of standard, um, and everything in between, and there's four levels of orchestra and you, you basically apply. You don't have to have done the grades but you kind of have to give a rough whereabouts and you know you give a bit of you playing, um and her um, you know I'm sure you're aware of her, but one of her big things is that she feels that mass music making, done to a really high level, is a really transformative way to make music and it's a really life level, is a really transformative way to make music and it's a really life changing thing for a young person to experience, you know, that inspiration of being, you know, a little one who might only have been playing for six months seeing, you know, an older kid who's, you know, 10 years older than them, but you know being like, wowed by them because they're, you know, they're in the same same vicinity and they're getting to experience that and to to play with them. So it's all based around that sense of um. You know that physicality of being in a room and making music. So, you know, at our biggest one, we've had nearly 400 young people um in the room doing a massed piece and then they go off and they do smaller, smaller orchestras around those levels, um, anyway.
Rebecca Driver:So this, we did three of those sessions in um early 2020 and then, of course, we all know what happened the pandemic hit. So after that, it was well, you know, what are we gonna do, um, are we gonna move this? You know, can we move it online? And they did. They managed to find a way um to do a virtual sessions and um, you know it, it was a big gamble because we had no idea, uh, whether it was really going to work until you try these things. But we thought, well, we may as well.
Rebecca Driver:And we opened it and in this was in may 2020 and in five days, over 7000 people signed up. It was unreal and you know, we got these incredible letters from adults saying this is the most amazing thing my kids are doing, but actually I'm furloughed, I'm not at work, so I'm getting my violin out and I'm going to join too, and it's giving us purpose and structure. So this virtual community was born and that was all born out through digital outlets basically. You know we did so much of that as a socials campaign and you know, we'll never know, but I think probably actually we would have got to that eventually, but I think the pandemic accelerated that for sure. Yeah.
Nick Petrella:Rebecca, at what point do most of your clients realize they need a PR firm?
Rebecca Driver:Yeah, this is such an interesting question. I think it's so different for every person or organisation and I think people come to us at all points of their careers or, you know, there can be. I've got loads to say, I've got a really great story to tell and I think this is a moment I need to talk to someone. I'm working with the wonderful soprano, claire Booth, at the moment, um, uh, who is absolutely fantastic, um, in her mid-40s, um, and she, we've worked together before, um, and she came to me and said oh, you know, I've got this really big year coming up. You know, if you've got space, can you do something? Um, and it's just because she's you know she had two albums coming out. It's she's a particularly um, a big advocate of Schoenberg and it's his 150th anniversary this year. In fact, it was, uh, last Friday, um, and so you know she had all this Schoenberg activity coming out. Some of her albums were featuring Schoenberg things. So there was a really strong narrative and there was loads to say. So you know she came knowing that there was lots to talk about. So that's a project and she's come doing that.
Rebecca Driver:Then there might be other scenarios where, you know, a young artist, um, you know, suddenly feels like things are gathering pace and they want someone to then help them get to that next level, but they've got lots to say. So I, you know someone like the saxophonist, jess Gillum, who was in the final of Young Musician in 2016. We've worked with. We worked with Jess for a long time and you know she came, you know, still quite actually kind of just before the pandemic started, and we work with her kind of on and off on a project basis now. But yeah, you know it's that kind of thing.
Rebecca Driver:And then for an organisation, there are so many reasons.
Rebecca Driver:It might be that they don't, you know, they're smaller and they don't have specialist PR in-house, so they decide to use an external agency.
Rebecca Driver:And I think sometimes the positive of that is that because we've got lots of clients and there's then lots of cross-fertilisation possibility, whereas if you're and it's, you know, let's not beat around the bush it's difficult to get hold of some of these really busy journalists, sometimes even when you've got lots of big things to offer them.
Rebecca Driver:So actually, if you're an organisation with an in-house person that's all you've got to talk about it's even harder. So sometimes that's where we bring the benefit, or it might just simply be that you know they've got a gap and they decided that they want someone external to do it, you know, for exactly those reasons we've been talking about. So we have a real mix of retained clients who you know we're working with on an ongoing basis, to projects like Claire artists that we work with on a regular basis, but it's very much in a project-led way when there's something that they specifically think they've got to say. So yeah, there's a whole host of different possibilities and it's really just a dialogue quite frankly, yeah, and what should an artist or an organization expect?
Andy Heise:So I've got this story, we've talked and we agree we have something to share with the world. What should an artist or organization expect when working with a firm like yours?
Rebecca Driver:and expect when, when working with with a firm like yours. Yeah, so it's it again. This is. This is a really tricky one, because the pr is a risk, like you'd be lying if you said it wasn't, because you cannot ever guarantee that you're going to get it, um, and anyone that does is absolutely talking nonsense, because you can have the best story in the world, but you know, if it collided with the day that the Queen died, forget it.
Rebecca Driver:Like you know so you know, all that planning that you put in to announce something, to place something, it's up in a, you know, like that, if the wrong story runs on the wrong day for you, you know so it is a risk because you cannot guarantee. So you know we work. Of course I can only talk about how we work, but we work in a way which is really transparent, really communicative. We're in touch with our clients all the time. They know what we're doing, they know what's happening and I think this is really important, particularly in periods where things don't go your way, because absolutely that happens.
Rebecca Driver:In periods where things don't go your way, because absolutely that happens, you know you have to be pretty tough skinned to work in what we're doing, because it's really like a roller coaster of you know. Sometimes you'll get all the wins and you'll have the most amazing week, and sometimes you'll have a blooming awful week when nothing goes right and nothing goes your way. So you know you have to be prepared for those highs and lows, because there really are highs and lows. And so you know, I think in those periods where things aren't going quite the way you want them to, it's almost more important to be communicating with your clients and talking to them and explaining you know what you're doing, how you're doing it, why you're doing it, all of those things so that they really see that you're doing the work.
Rebecca Driver:Because actually, if you try and sugarcoat it and cover it up, I I think that's worse, you know sure sure yeah um, so, so, yeah, um, and then I I think, um, you know, obviously, knowledge, I think, is really important for um, for the team to have you know.
Rebecca Driver:I think anyone should expect you to have knowledge in the sphere that you're working in, in a PR world, and also passion. I think you know you're selling something ultimately, and I think if you're not passionate about it, you're not going to do as good a job ultimately. And you know, every single person that works at RDMR absolutely loves classical music and the arts, and I think that's so, so important, because I really do believe that you'll ultimately do a better job of selling whatever it is you're talking about, if you care about it and you've got a love for it. Um, and then, and then I think the final thing is that you know, there, there needs to be a good information flow between the client and you. You know we're only as good as the, the what we have to work with. You know, so, um, if that's not there, then your job is all the all the harder yeah yeah to your point.
Nick Petrella:You can't fake passion and empathy exactly, exactly 100. Yeah, rebecca I Exactly. Exactly 100%, Rebecca. I assumed early on you landed your clients from personal relationships. Is that correct? And how do you do it now, 14 years into it?
Rebecca Driver:Yes, it's a really good question. It is. It's a small world ultimately that we operate in. You know it's it's not very big really. So actually, you know, when you've been in it for a while, you start to really get to know more people, and a lot of it is word of mouth.
Rebecca Driver:Um, and I would I would say that we've been incredibly lucky and have had lots of very kind, supportive people that that recommend us um, and that's been absolutely key to our growth and I'll forever be grateful to colleagues for suggesting us to people. But you know, truly and I don't mean to sound this in an arrogant way but we've never gone out there and knocked on doors and said, hey, we want to do your PR. It's been much more organic than that. You know it's been someone coming to us and saying we need this, are you interested? And you know there might be other four other prs going for it, but then you put in a in a pitch and you go for it and you get some of them.
Rebecca Driver:You don't get all of them, but that is truly how the work tends to come in um, because it is a small knit community ultimately. You know it's not massive. So you know, and I've been doing this now for 20, however many years it is. So, yeah, you know, I think that we spend a lot of time. Maddy, who's the director at RDMR, and I spend an awful lot of time nurturing relationships within the sector and maintaining strong relationships with people, because, ultimately, that's at the heart of everything for us. Um, you know it's really important. So, yeah, I think, um, you know, a lot of it really is still done in that word of mouth way still right well, and to that point I mean clients.
Andy Heise:Clients are just one part of the equation here. Now you also have relationships that you need to nurture and find and grow in media outlets. So how do you approach that?
Rebecca Driver:Yeah, as I was touched on earlier, you know I think so much of what we do is about our contacts and our relationships with the media. So you know, again, it's about nurturing those relationships and, and you know, I've spent 20 plus years doing that. Maddie, who works with me, has been, you know, 15, 16 years. So collectively, you know, plus the rest of the team, we have a lot of um experience, um and time that we've spent nurturing and developing those relationships. Um, so I think it's really important to see journalists regularly, to speak to them, to maintain those relationships, but to also, as I was saying earlier, to constantly be on the lookout for new possibilities and avenues. So it's, it's a really a combo of those two things.
Andy Heise:You know it's it's nurturing the existing, but it's also being on the lookout for the new as well absolutely, yeah, yeah, and, speaking of your team, it looks like you have about seven people or so, including including yourself.
Rebecca Driver:Um, just yeah so my website. Yeah, so my myself and my husband justin, and then yeah, five, five others yeah, great yeah, but it was it was gone sorry, oh no, I was just gonna.
Andy Heise:I was just gonna ask how do you, how did you go about building that team and when did you know it was time to build a team and all of that?
Rebecca Driver:Yeah that has been really organic, I would say so. When we started it was just, yeah, just myself and Justin, and I would say it was about 10 months in that we employed someone and actually for me that was far more terrifying than going out on my own, because then suddenly you're responsible for someone's livelihood. You know. That felt like a much bigger weight than my own. You know, if it was just me, I can go and get another in-house job, whatever, but as soon as you are, you know the person that has to ensure that the salary's coming in, etc. That's a whole different ballgame. So that actually, for me, was probably the far more stressful stressful is the wrong word. Like I, we utterly embraced it Because we knew if we were going to do it, we had to do it, but it was very small steps, I would say so.
Rebecca Driver:You know, every time we've increased it's only been one person and it's been because we've got offers of work on the table that we haven't got the capacity to deal with within the current size of the team. So you then have to make sure you've got enough work to then pay for everything and it builds from there. So, yeah, it's been a very organic and not a fast process at all and actually I don't. I don't, you know we work in a very bespoke way, you know we work in a very detailed way, and actually I think if we were to get too much bigger, we would struggle to do that in quite the same way. So, yeah, I don't see us getting massively bigger, if I'm honest.
Nick Petrella:I've heard steady wins the race right. You're taking those baby steps and growing.
Rebecca Driver:Yeah, absolutely.
Andy Heise:I've heard other entrepreneurs talk about bringing on their first employee and you know, to your point is, they see these people, you know what. Maybe they have families, uh, maybe they buy a new car or something like that, and you're, as the as their employer, you're looking at that as like, okay, they're like they're taking a bet on me and I need to, you know, make sure that we're doing everything we can to keep this thing moving forward yeah, it's absolutely, and and if I'm totally honest, I probably can't think about it too much, okay, all right we'll
Announcer:move on.
Rebecca Driver:No, no, it's fine, but it probably would stress me out beyond all recognition, so you know in a way, I I think I just have to sort of go, this is just what we do it's what we do, yeah yeah, yeah, you know, but um, but no, I'm very proud of it sure that's great you mentioned pitching to new clients, so I'm wondering what does your pitch include and what's your biggest value proposition?
Nick Petrella:Or does it vary depending on the client?
Rebecca Driver:Yeah, it really varies depending on the client, I would say. But obviously we're always talking about who we are and what we do, and that's our biggest value proposition about who we are and what we do, um, and that that's our biggest value proposition, you know it's. It's it really making people understand what our offer is and what we're, what we're about. And we, we do very detailed proposals when we pitch for business, so people are really clear from the outset what we would be looking at and how we work. So there can be no kind of um surprises or so, yeah, we, we do it in a very detailed way, basically, and, um, that's the way we, we like to work. But it is quite a bespoke thing, um, I would say, because people want varying, varying things often. So you know, there's not a one-size-fits-all response to that really yeah, gotcha does it does.
Andy Heise:Does it work in your world like if will an organization put out a, a call for proposals or something, and then you're competing with other pr firms? Is that how it works, or do people usually reach out to you knowing they want to work with you? A?
Rebecca Driver:bit of both I would say so, um, I'd say there's. I'm sure this happens in the kind of bigger corporate world, the kind of like you know this tender is open, you can apply for it. Less so in our world I have had a couple of those before and someone's approached and said oh, we're doing it currently and you've got to go through that tender process and it's a much more formal thing. But normally someone will ring you up and say we're looking for someone, we're talking to a few people. Would you be interested in putting your hand in?
Andy Heise:the room, it's that kind of thing.
Rebecca Driver:Yeah.
Andy Heise:So we're four years past the onset of the COVID-19 pandemic. Looking back, what was kind of your strategy that you developed during that time and is there anything that you started doing then that you've now incorporated in sort of what you do on a regular basis in a quote unquote post-pandemic world.
Rebecca Driver:They're our favorite phrase, post-pandemic. Yeah, it's wild to think that it's four years. Um, yeah, it's wild to think that it's four years, isn't it? It's crazy, um, but honestly, it was so chaotic in those first weeks and months, um, I think, my, I mean that that in that really first bit, um, you know, I think all of us in in the creative sector just thought my god, we're gonna, you know, everything's gonna go, we're gonna lose everything, um, and then obviously, slowly, things started to settle a little bit, um, and the government here found a kind of cultural recovery fund which meant that organizations could apply for some money to sustain them and all of those things. And once we got to that point, um, I think it was clearer that, you know, there was a chance that our organizations actually might keep us on, because they still wanted to have a story to say and something to do, and whenever they could work digitally, they were working digitally, whenever they could have audiences. You know, we were lucky to work with, um, some big organizations that really kept that going and were very kind of on it. Whenever things opened here, they would be presenting things, um, so actually we, we were extremely fortunate, um, and of course, you know, um, we negotiated on fees and things because everyone was being cut and the money wasn't coming in, but actually we still kept going and we kept working with pretty much all of our clients, bar a couple of individuals who obviously lost all their work and weren't earning anything. And so, actually, because we couldn't travel, because I was very lucky that our office that we rented was up for contract renewal in the Julyuly of 2020, so we obviously ditched the office, um, and that meant that any kind of cuts that we had, uh, from clients were sort of weighed out by the gain from the office. So actually, we we were extremely fortunate and it didn't have to furlough anyone. We all kept going, um. So so, yeah, I look back on it and I feel really, really, really lucky, but I think the main change probably post-pandemic, has probably been how we work, to be honest, because I think it's made us much smarter.
Rebecca Driver:I think you know, just, we used to do ridiculous things like go into the office every day and trek across London for an hour, for a half an hour meeting. I mean why it's bonkers and such a waste of time when you look at it practically. So I think it's made us smarter and I think you know we're much better at managing our time. Um, and you know we, we now do have a physical space. We have an office in london, um, which I think we, we really, we really umdenard about whether we needed that, but we really feel we do, and particularly with the younger members of the team, I think it's really important, particularly in the role that we're doing.
Rebecca Driver:You know so much of it is learning on the job. Prs are very difficult. You can do all the courses you like on pr, but actually you learn it doing it. And still now, to this day, you know, there'll still be scenarios where I'm like, well, that's a new one. Um, you know, and, and it's your experience of those collective things that you've worked on, worked on and you know, the principles are, of course, all the same, but even still, it might be a scenario that you've not had to deal with before, um, so you know it.
Rebecca Driver:I think for the younger members of the team a, it's just that office environment and camaraderie and colleagues, um, but that's true for all of us.
Rebecca Driver:I mean, I did, I hated being stuck at home, um, you know, in my four walls during the pandemic, I like it for a period of time, but not constantly, you know, because so much of what we do is about talking to people and relationships and seeing people and being at live events.
Rebecca Driver:You know that that's so a huge part of our sector. So I think that for me has been the biggest shift is working in a more hybrid way, um, and being being more streamlined and that. So you know, we tend to do three days a week in the office, two days a week from home, which is a very standard kind of format here in the UK at the moment, um, and we're finding that works really well. I live outside of London, um, I'm commutable, but um, which I was doing pre-pandemic um, but it just means that actually the days that I don't, the days that I'm in the office, tend to be structured more differently from pre-pandemic. You know, I tend to. They'd be all about seeing people, seeing journalists, seeing clients, um team stuff, and then my home days are very much head down get stuff done, um.
Nick Petrella:You know uninterrupted yeah, exactly, yeah, yeah, for sure when, when should musicians or any artists think of themselves as a brand?
Rebecca Driver:yeah, this, I think this is, um, this can feel a bit crass, uh, when you know people cringe a bit when you can see them kind of go. Oh, I don't want to be a brand, but you know, I absolutely agree and my answer to it is that actually, always, you know, I think you, you have to think of yourself in that way, as a product. Basically, you know, because you, you will find everything you do as an artist will impact on your image, as it were, um, if you prefer to refer to it that way. So I think it's vital to be aware of this when you're making decisions because, ultimately, every, you know everything you do, how you present yourself to, from what you're wearing to what you say, your tone, your vibe, all of those things are part of your brand and you know, people might not want to think of it like that, but it's, it's the reality so from the start from the start.
Andy Heise:Yeah, is what is what? Yeah? I think so yeah, what are some of those most important elements that artists or organizations should be thinking about when it comes to brand identity? You mentioned a few there, yeah.
Rebecca Driver:I think also. You know, I think particularly for organizations. You know it's what's your USP, what's? You know what's the thing that makes you stand out from the crowd, from the crowd, and how can you differentiate yourselves from your competitors and other people, particularly in the crowded? You know world that we live in, where there's so much noise, as we talked about earlier. You know it's that, those five P's, isn't it Of purpose, perception, personality. I'm going to forget one position performance. You know those are the. Those are the things that an organisation needs to be thinking about and it's absolutely vital that everyone's on the same page and using the same messaging, albeit probably packaged slightly differently depending on which stakeholder you're you're talking to. You know, if you're talking to a donor, you might talk slightly differently from how you're talking to a journalist, but but you know the, ultimately, the core, the core thing that you're saying, needs to be consistent.
Nick Petrella:So we hear this all the time there's no such thing as bad publicity Is. Is that true?
Rebecca Driver:No, I just there is absolutely bad publicity and anyone that tries to tell you otherwise. Yeah, I don't't buy at all that. All publicity is good publicity and I think there are times when it can be really damaging. So you know, I, yeah for sure I don't buy that okay, good put that.
Andy Heise:Yeah, rebecca. We've reached the point of the interview where we ask all of our interviewees the same three questions, and the first question is what advice would you give to others wanting to become an entrepreneur?
Rebecca Driver:um, such a good question and one I slightly struggle with. Actually it's funny. Um, I, I think network speak to people. Do your homework. Um, make sure you really know your product, make sure you really understand what it is you're doing, that you have a love for what you're doing. Shadow people, try and get experience with people that are doing it already. Um, I think you, it's all those things that probably everyone says, but it's so true, and I think it's vital to kind of have that hands on experience and you know, to really know that it's what you want to do and to work hard. You know what you put in, you get out, and I really do believe that.
Nick Petrella:What can we do to ensure the arts are more accessible and reaching the widest possible audience?
Rebecca Driver:I think the first thing I really feel about this is I think it's all of our responsibility. I don't think it lies with any one individual organisation. I think we all have to be doing our part to, in whatever part of the, the you know, the ecosystem you're in, um. I think it's so, so crucial that we all see that we, we have a role to play here. You know, be it hiring a device workforce, ensuring that marketing's representative of the society that we're living in, to the breadth of artists that we're working with. You know, be it hiring a device workforce, ensuring that marketing is representative of the society that we're living in, to the breadth of artists that we're working with. You know, we can all have a say and an impact on that, and I think that we'll only get better at it by doing more of that.
Andy Heise:Basically, Lastly, what's the best artistic or entrepreneurial advice you've been given?
Rebecca Driver:um. So I think when I was setting up the business um, a few people said to me make sure you get your finances well set up from the start, and that was absolutely invaluable advice. Um, it's so crucial it's. It's obviously, you know, for most people the thing they probably know least about if it, particularly if you're in the arts sphere.
Rebecca Driver:Um, exactly you know, it's slightly, slightly different if you're working in a, in a money sector, um, but yeah, and that was really really really helpful advice. And I, and then I think, from a more kind of um career wise, I think two people I've mentioned already have have been massive influences on my career, and that was Devorah, who I mentioned earlier, where I, you know, I really cut my cloth in the PR world and you know she, she really taught me everything, um. And then I mentioned Roger Wright earlier who, um, I worked with first at the BBC proms. Um, in in 2008, worked on his first prom season, and then, um, I worked with him for a decade when he was running Britain Peers Arts. Um, and he's just left there.
Rebecca Driver:Um, you know, we've worked together for 17 years and I'd say he's been a real just. You know, we all have those figures in our life who, those mentors, those guides, those people that you go to with a problem, that always help you find a solution. He's absolutely been that for me and continues to be, you know, and I feel very lucky to have that. It's it's an amazing thing.
Nick Petrella:Yeah, that's great, Rebecca. It's been great hearing your passion and how you developed your talent stack to create your media relations company. Thanks for coming on the podcast.
Rebecca Driver:Thank you so much for having me. It's been lovely to talk to you.
Andy Heise:Thanks, Rebecca.
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