Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast: Making Art Work
Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast: Making Art Work
#310: Vera Holczer-Waroquet (Pianist & Founder of Aurora School of Music) (pt. 2 of 2)
Today we released part one of our interview with Vera Holczer-Waroquet. She’s a Hungarian pianist who came to the US after finishing her degree at Budapest’s Bartok High School Conservatory. She studied music at UCLA and went to graduate school at the Cleveland Institute of Music. Upon graduation, she started a small teaching studio that quickly grew into the Aurora School of Music that trains over 1,000 students per week and hosts numerous events she hosts each year.
Anyone interested in launching any type of arts teaching studio, or needing inspiration on how to grow a teaching studio, should tune in to hear what Vera has to say! https://auroraschoolofmusic.com/
Hi Nick Petrella here. This episode is sponsored by Volkweins Music, a full-service shop that's been meeting the musical needs of musicians for over 135 years. They offer a huge selection of instruments, accessories, music and more. They also have an unmatched instrument repair department with some of the most experienced technicians in the business. For years they've serviced my personal and school instruments, and their attention to detail is why I and professional musicians from around the globe trust Volkweins to service their gear. Head over to volkwinesmusiccom to see what they can do for you. That's V-O-L-K-W-E-I-N-S music. com, helping people discover music since 1888.
Announcer:Welcome to the Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast. Making Art Work. We highlight how entrepreneurs align their artistry, passion and vision to create and pursue opportunities to capture value in the arts. The views expressed by guests on the Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast are solely their own and do not necessarily represent the views of the podcast or its hosts. The appearance of a guest on the podcast, the venture they represent or reference to any product or service does not imply an endorsement or recommendation by the podcast or its hosts. The content provided is for entertainment and informational purposes only and does not constitute business advice. Here are your hosts Andy.
Andy Heise:Heise and Nick Petrella. Hi Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast listeners. My name is Andy Heise.
Nick Petrella:And I'm Nick Petrella. Vera Holczer-Waroquet is on the podcast today. She's a Hungarian pianist who came to the US after finishing her degree at the Bartok High School Conservatory in Budapest. She studied music at UCLA and went to graduate school at the Cleveland Institute of Music. Upon graduation, she started a small teaching studio that quickly grew into the Aurora School of Music that trains over 1,000 students per week. Vera's website is in the show notes where you can learn more about her, her studio and the numerous events she hosts each year. Thanks for being here, vera.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Thank you for having me. This is great.
Nick Petrella:We spoke about finance and we know that you bootstrapped and did a lot of sweat equity and we always hear that artists have a difficult time raising money for their projects, whatever those projects might be. And you said, originally people didn't look at you for financing, and what I'm wondering is at what point were you able to obtain that financing?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:yeah, it was 2016. What a new be of that. Well, I think it's more complex than that, right, and I understand that. I understand that some artists it's totally different to look at the world from for-profit end versus non-profit end. This is a completely different world. You always think what can I do to bring in money versus what can I do so people give me money. This is a totally different way to look at things, right.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Right and so, obviously, when I looked at financing for a bank in 2012, 13, 14, 15 and all that, we have had already close to 600 to 800 students, so that you know the revenue was good, but you still need. You can't just walk into a bank and say, hi, my name is Vera Alter. Okay, I know what you want to do. It's a music school, the best deal of your life. No, first of all, banks don't even know what a music school is. They not they. They only know, okay, oberlin, cim, completely different structure. So one thing is you know, obviously, my husband is fantastic. He's got an MBA from Carnegie Mellon, his name is Christoph and he's very good working in the banks afterwards, once the relationship is established.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:But you need someone who's gonna make a miracle happen and I think you see that in my story, there's always gonna be someone who was there to make it happen. The very beginning, I also had friends who helped me with okay, you know, I'll tell you how to do the drywall. I won't be there, but I'll tell you how to make it happen. The very beginning, I also had friends who helped me with okay, you know, I'll tell you how to do the drywall. I won't be there, but I'll tell you how to do it. Of course, I didn't follow it, but you know someone has to come and you know, bring some food for you, because they know you're going to pass out in between teaching right? So you always have this amazing support around because they see that the mission is greater than you.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:So one of our parents was a really amazing banker working at Huntington Bank and also the consulting in this area, and he came to P Anderson's show me the papers, man, let's get this going. So he's the one who made it happen with the connections. That's great. You need always someone. I call them this. I think some angels come down to help me sometimes, here and there, and I think this is amazing. I think this has got to happen to other people too. Sometimes.
Nick Petrella:I'm sure so. Nine to ten years from the start of your business. It took nine to ten years to actually get the financing. Oh, absolutely, so you had enough. Yes, yeah, okay, I mean 2006,.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:I was able to buy that ranch building right.
Nick Petrella:Okay.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:And that was not that big of a financial I mean looking back now, of course, at that time was a big, big deal, of course. But, you know, my credit was still not great, so it was 9%. It was horrible. I mean, if you look at it you know no, it was 11%, jeez, 11%. You have to be crazy to sign something like that, right, but then what happened is the second time. That would not even make sense to anyone.
Andy Heise:Yeah, yeah.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Unless you're crazy about what you're doing and I think the bank recognized that I won't quit for a long time and because, no matter what you do, the construction of a hall is going to be way more than the equity in the building or just the appraisal of the building. So I'll just give you that it's going to appraise for 1.11 million, but what you need is $2 million, so it doesn't make sense. Who's going to buy it? Nobody else, unless they are doing the same thing as you the chances of that. So the risk for that is high. That's what's for the small business loan, of course. This is great.
Nick Petrella:Yeah, you should have countered the 11% interest rate with free piano playing for other events. Private performance.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:I know right. You were not there at that time, Nick, you should have.
Nick Petrella:Boy, this could have turned out totally different.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:It's totally different.
Nick Petrella:Yeah.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Awesome.
Andy Heise:Vera, we've talked a little bit about this, but when you decided to expand from your single teaching studio and start building out your full school, how did you assess the competitive landscape in the area that you were going into and what strategies did you use to position yourself within the community that you were opening?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:This is a great question, because I think what you're referring to here is how are you going to distinguish yourself from everything that's around you already?
Andy Heise:Right, there's a lot of private teachers out there. Yes, right, yeah.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:So what I noticed is, you know, I taught a lot in Hungary, even as an 18-year-old, because my degree, the Bartók Conservatory, has already gives you a certification for teaching early on. So I did that. And then Los Angeles as well, and when I came to this area I realized that there's this culture of everybody's going to their little neighborhood piano teacher. And then a neighborhood piano teacher is super sweet, gets you your favorite candies. Never went to school for music, but you know she learned piano and so they're learning notes and rhythms and some theory and maybe some fingerings right.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:And then there's the other one. You want to take your kid to CIM. Whoa, amazing name, fabulous reputation. You go in there and your stomach is cringing. No one says hi, extremely competitive, no fun. So I said you know what? What about the two together? Hello, that would be amazing, super high standards. You get the kids into an education system where, if they decide at 15, 16, 17 that they want to pursue music career, they're extremely successful. Early age, on three and four, you're already training them for the long-term musical concepts that they need to know for success, right?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:yeah, yeah and you bring in all the fun with it. How about that amazing best combination? That's how it worked that's great.
Nick Petrella:So and that leads into the question that I was going to ask a little bit later is what differentiates your school from other schools or teaching studios, so not specifically a CIM, but other teaching studios. Why would someone want to go to Aurora School of Music as opposed to a different one?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:This is great One. I mean, facility is always something as a big thing we want to say, yes, humans make a location, but when it comes to music and performance and auditorium, a concert place that you can now provide extremely unlimited sky's the limit on programming what you can do. So you can put together a musical theater production, you can put together a philharmonic orchestra production. Now you can put together an ensemble that's not just a string quartet but has piano quartet and everything else on stage master classes, studio classes, camps and you name it right. So, and then that's what we are tapping into, and then you know, at that point you can have I'm going for right now some curriculums to be accredited, like my method, but also is to have a young artist program so the kids can actually have, accrue a course, curriculum that they can transfer or show or have anybody understand, maybe internationally or nationally, what they have accomplished With theory classes and history classes and ensembles and master classes and competitions.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:I started hosting competitions statewide, not just a piano but a strings and woodwind this time of year, starting it, and then it's going to be percussion next year. So we are adding that onto our curriculum and because we have a Philharmonic Orchestra production twice a year. It's a side-by-side orchestra. Actually we are getting ready for that next week. The top selected students with their faculty who is already an incredible musician, because that's the requirement for me to be even teaching here and some of the alumni who became professional musicians, and some you know. You know we go as far as the Cleveland orchestra members joining us and making it into like a severance hall right here at Aurora, except gourmet food and cocktails.
Andy Heise:Awesome.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:So then you have an opportunity for students to go to a concerto competition inside their own school.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Right, it's very unusual, right? Yeah, yeah. So, yes, we have the recitals every three months. We have the chamber music every three months. We have adult student recitals. Every three months, we have adult rock concerts, and I could just name the program. We have like 100 events a year in our calendar. That is not even. It's just growing, you know. So I think you need someone who's willing to tap into that. As an owner, I do consultation and people sometimes call me for advice, maybe out of Texas, and they have a different kind of landscape and different kind of setup, and they're always asking me so how do I keep my teachers and my clientele?
Nick Petrella:You've got to plug them into a program that's so good they do not want to ever not have it again you know Well, and it's not only that engagement but it's revenue streams, because you get income from each of those activities. I would imagine.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:I mean not always, because you can do two ways. I mean, do you want to put it into the tuition and then you, you make it more like you have to tier things right. Tiering is very important. So you have the basic concert engagement every three months. That is kind of a requirement for teachers to prepare the students for, because after that their engagement, enthusiasm, level of dedication and consistency will grow if they don't participate in it. And then when it comes to ensembles and added on things, that's different.
Nick Petrella:But you consider that in your pricing.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Ensembles are on top of it. And then, when it comes to young artists program, I try to make it as totally accessible because they are selected students.
Nick Petrella:Okay.
Andy Heise:The other thing that strikes me is like the confidence building that that that has in in those students. You know, I I I grew up in a fairly not a small town, but it's fairly small city and you know these types of things didn't exist. I didn't even know what they were and then, exactly like you're saying, I say, oh, I think I might want to go to music school. No idea what that actually means, like how to prepare, how to do, what's it even take to audition? I don't even know what that means.
Andy Heise:And so to have those types of tiered activities that are creating and instilling that confidence in those students to say, yeah, I can do this If I want to keep going, there's a way for me to do it and I have the confidence to be able to do it.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Can I tell you this is the most exciting part of what I do, because I'm the one who happens to, and some of my teachers have been with me for 21 years.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:It's the most amazing thing to teach with someone alongside and then raise these students from diaper three to audition time and then they come back and they go to Cincinnati Conservatory and Eastman and they come back and they go to Cincinnati Conservatory and Eastman and they come back and teach here. So you have your students, who you were like babying and then nurturing and then raising them up and encouraging, and they have done their senior recital and competitions and you're right there with them and they went to their career and they're back teaching as a faculty now. I mean that's the most rewarding thing in the world. I'd say there with them and they went to their career and they're back teaching as a faculty now I mean that's the most rewarding thing in the world.
Andy Heise:I say definitely, and a testament to the programs that you've built.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:So thank you, yeah.
Nick Petrella:So, as we talked about earlier, you mentioned engagement. I'm a big proponent of engagement. Speak about that a lot in my classes. How do you engage with your students and the parents, since the users the students right they're not always your customers per se. How do you engage with everyone?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Well, I mean, today, culture is different than 50 years ago. Today, culture is different than 50 years ago. 50 years ago, your parent told you you're going to do piano lessons and you had to do it. So this is how you get all these traumatic experiences, this generation of parents. Well, I don't want to do it, but my kid wants to do it. I guess I'm doing it. So it's a very different landscape today, because every parent is motivated by their children's smile, happiness. They want to come back. They're not even going to doubt the value of it.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:So how do you engage with a kid I mean, this could be a podcast on its own. Of course is that from the first moment they show up, they're my center of my attention. I don't engage as much with the parent as the child. Everything goes, you know. And then, yes, hi, nice to meet you. I'm Miss Vera, thumbs up. But I'm constantly with the kid in their face, very much in their physical space. If they're younger, if they're younger, high five, counting fingers. You're amazing. You showed up, you just showed up, and I'm already celebrating that.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:And from the first moment on, they have rewards for paying attention, doing things. I have this amazing, organic M&M's man, you would not believe it. It's called Unreal. It's all from plants and fruits and it tastes amazing. Every parent is happy. I give them M&M's that has no tides and no coloring and none of that stuff, right? We have organic lollipops man Yummy arts lollipops. People come through the door. They already go for that lollipop. Man yummy arts lollipops. People come through the door, they already go for that lollipop jar. I tell you that. So it's, it's that that, but it's not. The thing is what's associated with it. What feeling is associated? Is that?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:I think it's very important for teachers to understand that we have this balance how much I call, how much you punch, you hug right. So how much you push them to do, and you have to have that perfect balance to reward and emotionally, show emotional distortion when they're not doing well and when they're doing well, as that balance right. And then, when you connect with them in such a deep level and such a close level, that's when you can really really push them to the next level and it's I don't like to use the word push, it's more like the inspiration, it's pull. You know, you inspire it. You don't have to have threatened and all that. None of that it's, it's more of that. Oh, my goodness, can you imagine you're going to pay this, this? Wow, this is going to be unbelievable and the same energy throughout the lesson.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:And then, of course, I train a lot about pacing and vocabulary and what are the associations psychologically on how you act and how to do the flowing and how to recognize stress and how to recognize, you know, motivation and, of course, the redirecting behavior, et cetera. This is all part of a training that could be I could talk about that for another hour that I'm sure you guys don't have. But that's very exciting and I think that's one thing that makes our team very unique is that they're extremely aware of how to lead a lesson and how to redirect, how to motivate, aware of how to lead a lesson and how to redirect, how to motivate, what are the vocabularies that we kind of commonly use to redirect and motivate children, and that these recitals are not mandatory but we kind of don't give them a choice and that way they experience the best. It's like you can't say no to an artichoke if you didn't try it, you have to try it.
Nick Petrella:Yeah, I love it. Love your passion. You're a good salesperson. I want to try the lollipops.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:You should, you should. They're really great, they're awesome.
Andy Heise:So you're obviously very engaged, very connected, very close with the students and the families that are a part of the school. Has there ever been an instance where you've sort of responded to the needs or desires or wants of your customers as part of your school offerings?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Oh, that happens all the time. That's such a great question. You're really formed by the demand all the time. That's such a great question. You're really formed by the demand all the time. Right, hey, early on, you should have all your recitals on a website. This was 2005,. Right, very early on, someone said Hi, can you imagine if you live-streamed we were one of the first place, 2009, that would live stream everything People would have all over the world would watch our recitals. Wow, then you know calendar needs. I think you guys should do rock band coaching. Oh, really Great, great idea, I think.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:But the best thing comes really from the teachers. So I want to make sure that I don't leave that out, that you can't create an amazing school without an amazing team that you listen to, because you can't be that know everything. I understand piano, but I'm still learning. I might hire someone from China who's going to show me something I've never heard of. Wow, so cool. So we engage with each other all the time, but over 20 years, I think that you just never stop learning. But I have a very, very strong vocal department who have extremely successful visions and they're very, very good at what they do. I can't say I understand that. So I have to listen for their needs and what the students want for the future as well.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:There's no way I could have put together a summer scenes musical theater program for two, three weeks where we come up with production. Are you kidding? I mean, that's not my world. But you just start facilitating as you grow. Your job and your role is more facilitating, recognizing talent, recognizing great ideas and recognizing not of a great idea, right? So? Um, same thing with my string faculty they're incredible and you so how to work.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:And then, of course, the percussion, and that's how the ensemble program is developing, because we have, you know, steel, drum and percussion ensemble and rock bands and jazz combos and everything else. But that wouldn't happen if a teacher says you know what we should do? A jazz combo, what do you think? Great, let's get it done. We should do a jazz combo, what do you think Great, let's get it done. So that's one of the reasons I think teachers love it here, because I make things happen with an incredible administration team who's trained to listen to, and this is their job to facilitate. And if it looks impossible, then we have to figure out how to make it possible, even if it looks impossible.
Nick Petrella:Well, you create an environment for growth, and if you're not growing, you're falling behind.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:That's right. So it's kind of self- propelled yeah. I don't think you want to be at a place where it's like okay, I think this is good. Now we have enough ensembles, we have everybody happy, let's go to the beach and I'm going to Puerto Rico for a month. See you later. No, it's not happening, even though I love Puerto Rico not that long.
Nick Petrella:Yeah, we spoke a lot about faculty and teachers, so I'm wondering what do you look for when you're hiring teachers and do they undergo background checks and things like that?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Yeah, of course I mean when you run a business you have lawyers putting contracts together.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:You want to have an amazing insurance guy or girl or whoever you have a relationship with and I have been very blessed with really good people. I mean, a background check is a minimum. I mean, you just got to do it. It depends on what, of course, your insurance requires and what kind of exact sites you have to put them through and what kind of processes, etc. Yeah, but I tell you what, if you have people who are eager to grow and they are graduating and they are young, the chances that you're going to have someone who's a film for 50 things is very rare. When you go higher age, that's when you have high risk, right. But what I'm looking for in teachers is that sparkle in their eyes. They have to show me this is not a job. If they come for making money and this is a side job because they want to do something else later in life, that's okay as long as they're honest. But most likely they would burn out, because I'm one of the only schools where there's not much break in between.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:You can't chill. It's three to nine nonstop. You barely go to the bathroom. So if you don't love it, you will be done. In three months you will quit because it's a heart-driven place. People are here because they love the process of teaching, not just the result. You have to be process oriented Number one, then you get the great results. So, um and and you see this in the interview right away you, you know the music comes through between the words and the lines. You can recognize immediately if they care about the student or they care about themselves.
Nick Petrella:Yeah, that's great.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:And then from there on you can know where to place them and I'm very, very blessed. It was difficult in the beginning. You had to. You know 2003,. You would write articles in the back of the newspaper who's going to respond? And then someone calls you bring. Oh my gosh, the whole process is so painful, right, first piano teacher until I find Miss Ruth Logan, who's from Mexico. She's fantastic. She's been with me for 21 years since the grand opening.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:I think I interviewed 10 piano teachers until I found her, because you know, people come in with. I did some piano when I was young and even though it says degree required, yeah. But now, today, it's so wonderful because I think the greatest testimony to what environment you can create is that the teachers who are here and they have to move on, they really do care and they want to help you. They are helping me with the replacement process. They find me the person that they recommend, based on understanding their teaching style and the standards.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:So at that point it's like do you think this or that? You know, perfect. But by the time the person comes in to see me in a concert hall, I kind of just want to make sure that they're real. Yeah, this is a real human. Otherwise, I think I'm pretty sure I mean I don't have to go through a lot of interviews and it's wonderful. And you know, the reputation of the school got to the point where also people who apply they kind of know what we are looking for. They already know what we are about.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Yep yeah, who apply. They kind of know what we are looking for. They already know what we are about. Everything is online and you can see a whole. Every single performance is documented in a gallery section, so you can have a million videos to go through to see how kids perform, if they're advanced or they're beginners, or what are their standards for all of the ensembles, et cetera.
Nick Petrella:Yeah, and we'll have your link in the show notes so people can look at every video you have on there.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Fantastic.
Andy Heise:Well, Vera, we've reached the point of the interview where we ask all of our interviewees the same three questions, and the first question is what advice would you give to someone else wanting to become an art entrepreneur?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:I know it sounds cliche, but just don't give up. Like you know, you just got to keep going. I mean it's going to suck so many times. I'll be honest with you. There's going to be mice. That's like what did I do? But it's the same thing with raising kids, right, it's with everything. You're gonna go to bed and say, what have I done? I should just gone and into a job where I can walk in and I can walk out. Great, you know, but it's, it's, it's, it's part of it. But uh, I think if you're really passionate about it, you realize that you will not be happy anywhere else. So this is great.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:And how lucky to I never take the freedom for granted to be independent. The fact that you can make your own decisions about any artistic or any personnel or any financial, any facility decisions is a huge privilege. I look at it as a privilege, not like oh my gosh, how much work. I mean, do you want to be a lawyer? You'll kill yourself too. So there you go. It doesn't matter and I get to do music all day. I mean it's not like running a business. If your operation systems are set up, it's not an everyday eight hours thing to sit there. The business is running. You're part of it. Even if you don't want to teach that much, you will be around music and all of that. If someone wants to have someone else run all the events and teaching, they will be still around.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:The aftermath of music, the happiness oh my gosh, this is so cool. Mr Andrew was the coolest thing. He showed me this amazing jazz chord. Oh my gosh, that was so cool. This is the environment. They're going to hear it all the time they pick up the phone to do a different lesson change or change a makeup lesson. Thank you so much. I just want to make sure you know that miss stephanie's the best food teacher ever. We tried so many ones, but she is just fantastic and I see the progress from day one. In two months I can't believe how much they improved. So improvement curve is a huge thing yeah, yeah, it's important.
Nick Petrella:What can we do to ensure the arts are more accessible and reaching the widest possible audience?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:You see, it's a very wide. It's a really big question, because arts is also very wide, right. So when it comes to rock, I think some of the rock stars have done a good job. They have millions of people coming right. I think we know that classical music has a little bit of oh, cleveland Orchestra, what's that? Oh, flute, oh, you know. So there's two things we have to do. First of all, we have to make it. We have to do first of all, we have to make it.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:I think the I think there is a, an element in a classical music that needs to be changed a little bit and I think a lot of people, people caught on and it's changing already that the audience is not separated that much from the stage. So there's that more of a connection addressing, addressing the audience, more talking. There's lectures now before Cleveland Orchestra, right, but I think the more students learn about that the better. I'm going to give you a perfect example. When someone is preparing for their senior recital at my school, they have to provide, based on instrument, between 45 minutes to 60 minutes pure music, and they fill up the hall and this is their own show, this is their final graduation recital, just like you would do it in college, except you have to address the audience all the time. Hey guys, thanks for coming in.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:The first song is going to be my dad's favorite. He thought he I'm never going to be able to sing it, and here I am. This is for you, Dad Boom. You know. So that they have, even if it's classical music. They have to have that connection to the audience that they don't feel that they're unapproachable, because as soon as you become a human being on stage, people love you more and they want to know more of that genre that you do. So I think that's one of the best ways to spread the love about it.
Andy Heise:That's very good. Lastly, what's the?
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:best artistic or entrepreneurial advice you've been given? Yeah, I thought about this a lot. This is a great question. Early on, I met someone who was extremely successful. He's still very, very successful. He owns most of the hospital cleaning facilities. So if you ever go to a hospital, he's going to clean your pillow. But he said something really cool which I didn't think for a long time, but it's really important Early on. You have to make a decision as an entrepreneur Early on. You want to be the most profitable or you want to be the best. It's two different ways to think and two different ways to build your business. You want to have multiple locations and invest into a system a system that works itself but it has to reach and you have to work on facilities reaching more and more and more and more clients or do you want to be the best where people come to you, no matter how far you are? And I think I decided number two for sure.
Nick Petrella:That's great, that's awesome. Well, thanks so much, vera, for being here. It's great hearing your engaging and thoughtful approach to building a lasting business. Really, you gave so much information that anyone interested in any sort of arts teaching studio is going to benefit.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Well, thank you, and I hope so, because you know what I know. If I can do it, anyone can do it. My English today is pretty comprehensive. You guys can hear and understand me, but I want you to imagine 21 years ago when I picked up the phone. It did not work well. So if I can get, just if I can do it, anyone can do it, I promise you. Thanks so much, vera Very welcome.
Andy Heise:Thanks so much, Vera.
Vera Holczer-Waroquet:Very welcome.
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