Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast: Making Art Work
Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast: Making Art Work
#315: Red Hot Annie (Burlesque Performer) (pt. 1 of 2)
This week on the podcast is part one of our interview with Red Hot Annie. For nearly twenty years she’s been a Chicago-based burlesque performer and creative entrepreneur who's been an advocate for helping artists build sustainable careers. As a performer, she offers dynamic live shows and empowering workshops designed to inspire confidence, connection, and bold self-expression.
We hope you join us for this entertaining interview, and hear how Annie bootstrapped her business from an idea into the brand she is today. https://redhotannie.com/ and https://www.youtube.com/@redhotannie
Welcome to the Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast. Making art work. We highlight how entrepreneurs align their artistry, passion and vision to create and pursue opportunities to capture value in the arts. The views expressed by guests on the Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast are solely their own and do not necessarily represent the views of the podcast or its hosts. The appearance of a guest on the podcast, the venture they represent or reference to any product or service does not imply an endorsement or recommendation by the podcast or its hosts. The content provided is for entertainment and informational purposes only and does not constitute business advice. Here are your hosts Andy Heise and Nick Petrella.
Andy Heise:Hi Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast listeners. I'm Andy Heise.
Nick Petrella:And I'm Nick Petrella. We have Anne Weinert on the podcast today. Her stage name is Red Hot Annie and for nearly 20 years she's been a Chicago-based burlesque performer and creative entrepreneur. Annie is also an advocate for helping artists build sustainable careers. As a performer, she offers dynamic live shows and empowering workshops designed to inspire confidence, connection and bold self-expression. We'll have her website and YouTube channel in the show notes so you can learn more about Annie and her activities. Thanks for coming on the podcast, annie.
Red Hot Anni:Thank you so much for having me.
Nick Petrella:We've never had a burlesque performer on before, so why don't you start by telling us what you do and why you decided to pursue burlesque as an art form?
Red Hot Anni:Oh, wow. Well, you know, I started performing when I was 15. I do burlesque, I'm a performer, I'm a producer, I'm an educator. I fell into the world of burlesque in about 2007. I was 27 years old and I thought that I was all washed up. At 27, I thought I was all washed up, which really just um is. I will talk more about that.
Red Hot Anni:But you know, it's funny the way that pressure is for, uh, for women and for performers in the world that you think that you have these tiny time frames but in reality there's so much that you can do over the course of a lifetime that you can create and help people with.
Red Hot Anni:And one of the reasons that burlesque, burlesque drew me in was really because I would go to these shows and I would be part of this and I would see the reaction from the other people who would come and attend the shows. Our shows are like 80% women in the audience, and so they would come up after the show and they'd be like, oh my gosh, just seeing you on stage, it just made me feel more confident. It made me feel like I could wear short sleeves or wear shorts again, or I mean, you would be surprised by how many people have deeply religious backgrounds that they're healing from? There is any number of ways that this art form, which to some people might feel extremely provocative at first, turns out to be just this really great portal for loving yourself again, accepting your body, being able to express yourself freely and really being able to tap into your feminine energy freely and really being able to tap into your feminine energy.
Andy Heise:I'm curious was there any specific moment or experience that made you realize that you could pursue this as a career and not just as a hobby or something to do for fun?
Red Hot Anni:Yes, definitely. Well, there were several small moments and they were really incremental, because it would be a lot about people coming up to me after the show and speaking to me about what they had seen when I thought I was just putting a little silly piece of artwork up on stage, and they would come back to me afterwards and just speak to the again. The feminine energy, the parts of it that have to do with the aesthetics, the red lipstick, the fishnets these things, when you're a girl, are alluring and attractive and interesting because you don't totally understand them yet, but you know by how they look that there's something that's going to feel different about integrating those things into your world. And some people are allowed to things into your world, and some people are allowed to and some people are not not allowed to. And and even in the fact that it and if you're not allowed to, it's all the more reason that when you get to end up being an adult, that you see this and you go that I never explored that part of myself and you know, for the amount of sexual energy that is put out into our culture these days, I find it shocking, and unfortunately not surprising, that there's not very much focus on really the feminine body, experience of sexuality and what it means to you know, to play within that A lot of women are afraid.
Red Hot Anni:They want to do it right. They want to get it right. They want to get it right. They want to. If they're going to do it, they want to have like a you know, a plan, a strategy and um and burlesque being in the moment. I think, realizing that people could use a skill that was about being in the moment and being in their bodies, I think I realized I could help change lives, when I, when people would approach me afterwards and say I need this, this, this made a difference to me, or I'm interested in learning more about that.
Andy Heise:So that's kind of what planted the seed for you to be able to either do more performances or start teaching how to do it.
Red Hot Anni:All of the above Because, of course, the entire thing feeds itself right. So you go out on stage, you create the art, and then someone comes up to you and they're like I wish I could do that or I wish I could create things like that, and either you're empowering them to create it on their own or they can come take classes or anything like that. But you know, we've seen a huge evolution with social media and the way that the internet has worked over the last 10 or 15 years. When I first started doing this, it was MySpace, it was paper flyers, it was. You know, you really had to tell people what burlesque even was like. It was just a very, very different time. Um, people would come to shows and they would feel unsure about themselves, like unsure about their bodies, unsure about their attractiveness.
Red Hot Anni:people wouldn't want to be photographed right I mean a lot has changed in 15, 20 years because now everybody's used to being in front of a camera, everybody's used to speaking. To some extent there's more confidence, the younger generations, absolutely the amount of confidence that people have, people have worked.
Nick Petrella:Yeah, I find it interesting. You said what 80% of your audience is women. Yeah, I don't know why, I just assumed it would be more men. But then the other thing is you had mentioned that they watch what you're doing and they say, boy, I'd like to be able to do that. Do they ever give you reasons, or what's a common reason why they?
Red Hot Anni:don't you break up with somebody and that person maybe made you feel like garbage at the end and you just feel like, how can I possibly get back to where I once was? Can I even get back to who I once was, or do I? Am I somebody new now? Um, a woman's life is full of transformation and becoming new people, decade after decade, year after year. So it really gives a lot of any any time you go through a change. Uh, old people move to a new city, people have just moved to a new city, they don't know who, you know where to make friends, especially friends who are going to be as, uh, outgoing and expressive as they are. Um, people who are going to want to go out and dress up. So it really is, you know, partially community. It's partially creativity and at the heart of it, it's about confidence and being willing to put yourself out there.
Nick Petrella:Yeah, and so where do you find inspiration for your shows? And, along those lines, have you ever copyrighted any of your original creations or choreography?
Red Hot Anni:Copywriting is really tricky with choreography and things like that, and I haven't. I haven't put a lot of energy into copywriting, but I find most of my inspiration in the most free source there is mother nature. I love to be out in nature. I love to put my bare feet on the ground, cold or not, icy or not, and I find all of my acts tend to have a connection to nature. I like bees and flowers and strawberries and the moon and all of the things that are extremely feminine energy.
Andy Heise:Great. So with regards to the actual creative process, so the inspiration a lot of it comes from nature and then the creative process. How inspiration? A lot of it comes from nature. And then the creative process. How do you take that inspiration and turn it into a show, a production, something like that?
Red Hot Anni:Well, the process is the most juicy part for most artists.
Red Hot Anni:I think it definitely is for me because I love to listen to music, I love to touch textures and see colors and I really, really love that process of slowly watching the piece of clay that is my art slowly become something. So often for me it might start with a piece of music or an inspiration and then I just start to obsess with that idea, if that makes sense. So how are the ways that I can incorporate this into a three to five minute act so that it makes an impact and it really um shines in that way that I want it to shine? And one of the things that I love the most about burlesque in particular is that, as a person who loves the process, it's never done, because one of the things that drew me to burlesque was when I had done regular theater.
Red Hot Anni:You would rehearse for six to eight weeks, you would do the show for a couple weeks and then you'd be done with it. It would be all gone all the lines, all the choreography, all the character, all the costumes. Bye, bye, see you later. And I love about burlesque is that I have acts I've been performing for 10 years and I've performed them in seven countries. And I love about burlesque is that I have acts I've been performing for 10 years and I've performed them in seven countries, and I get to and it's my act, it's all my acts. So, um, that, that is really what is so. What's so fun about it?
Nick Petrella:The process You're always iterating.
Red Hot Anni:Always, always iterating.
Nick Petrella:I was going to ask you you, you have a theatrical background, then Do you dance? You have a dance background.
Red Hot Anni:No, I didn't start dancing until I was 27. So when I started doing burlesque, that's when I started dancing. Up to that point, if you'd asked me, I'd say I have no rhythm and I have two left feet and the only thing I knew how to do on stage was to project my voice. Uh, and you know, and I, I, I got plenty of great cool little character roles, um, but dancing was never my forte and it wasn't until I started doing it, in the process of it, that I learned how to dance and I now consider myself quite a good dancer. Thank you very much.
Andy Heise:Well, and that's so where did? And I guess, going back back, like where did you first see burlesque, or when did you first get involved with it, like do you remember that moment?
Red Hot Anni:uh-huh. I do remember that moment because I brought a. I brought a guy to a burlesque show as a hot date. It was a hot date and I thought, oh, this will be a really hot date. We're going to go to this burlesque show, it's going to be really juicy and fun. And when I got there, I, I, I like I think everybody else in the whole world had a picture in my mind of what this, this art form, was.
Andy Heise:Right.
Red Hot Anni:And then when I showed up and I saw all of these women of different sizes, shapes, colors on stage, I looked backstage and it was all women running the tech and running the crew and I looked at the audience and it was mostly women in the audience and I I realized as I was watching it that these women had choreographed their own routines, they had made their own costumes, they had done it all themselves. And there I think every woman really can relate to the idea of the Jill of all trades doing it all yourself and, um, and especially at the beginning of burlesque, that really that really appealed to me and doing it all myself. But of course, over the course of time you learn you can't do it all yourself and it's not as much fun to do it by yourself anyways.
Andy Heise:Sure, and so you've got this catalog of um, what do you call them? Routines shows, yeah.
Red Hot Anni:Uh, either way Okay.
Andy Heise:And, and so you're, you're constantly adding to that, to that catalog, but you also, as you mentioned, you have some that you've done over and over again. Um, and they range in in duration. You said about three to five minutes. Yeah, you said about three to five minutes.
Red Hot Anni:Yeah, they're usually about three to five minutes, sometimes a little bit longer, but not too often.
Andy Heise:And when you say you produce a show, I'm guessing a club or some venue hires you to put on the show, so you're out hiring other dancers and things like that.
Red Hot Anni:Oh, there's a couple of different ways that it can work, because most of the time, as a producer, I book the venue, I pay for everything up front and then I re, I, um, I make the money back by selling tickets.
Red Hot Anni:So, I'll be responsible for pretty much the entire financial success of the show, which obviously is a little bit, uh, nerve wracking sometimes, but um, but also sometimes venues hire you out to to book a show, and then the other thing that I'm most commonly booked for is like Grandpa's turning 80 and we're throwing a party at a banquet hall and we want you to come pop out of a cake Gotcha, and that's a really good fun time. I think it's those experiences that have really shown me it's not about being perfect, it's about expressing yourself and being connected to your audience. That's what people really want out of an experience like that.
Nick Petrella:So do you have like props? Do you have a storage area for like a big cake and things that you have that?
Red Hot Anni:Yeah, I actually uh, I actually have a studio space now. I just opened a space it's called the Eclipse Room here in Chicago and I just opened it a couple weeks ago. Everything has been lining up for a really incredible 2025. And my nine-foot moon that I hang on and dance on will be moving there very shortly. But yes, I have a lot of props and costumes. I actually have more props and costumes than I do regular things. I think, wow, wow, yeah, my, my home is. I actually am a minimalist, so I really keep things very streamlined but there's some things you can't help but accumulate. A nine foot moon is not something easy to get to, to give to somebody else, or do something else with it's yours forever.
Andy Heise:So you have like a, like a u-haul that you drive around like how do you transport a?
Red Hot Anni:that's part of the production cost yeah, you know you go, it's okay. It's gonna be a hundred dollars to rent the van to move and it's gonna take us an extra hour to move the moon. So yeah it the production side of it is completely its own part of it.
Nick Petrella:Yeah, sure, I want to unpack that a little bit. It's a question I had later, but I'll just ask it now. So you have quite a few revenue streams on your website, but I'm wondering what the pay structure is for a typical performance. I think you said you get a percentage of tickets. Is there anything else? How does that work?
Red Hot Anni:No, yeah, actually, you know, usually I purchase, I pay for the rent of the space in advance, so I just recoup the costs. So I usually will get usually a hundred percent of the tickets and then I use that to pay my crew and my other cast members and everything like that. So the structure is usually that I get a hundred percent of it. But there are places like bars and stuff like that where you would get a flat fee or you might get a percentage of the bar. But I learned pretty early on in my process, uh, of producing that, if it, if it can't be totally transparent, then I don't, then I don't agree to it, because the thing with the bar sales and stuff like that is uh, you know, track it you can't track it and um people, people have been running bars and industries like that for much longer than burlesque dancers have existed, and so you know sometimes you're working with very deeply ingrained, uh, corruption so it's really like a it's's what bands do really.
Red Hot Anni:Yeah, oh yeah.
Nick Petrella:And before we get to Andy's question, quick question. You said you've been to seven countries, so is how did you get those invites and do you look at like Moulin Rouge as like the Carnegie Hall for your genre?
Red Hot Anni:A little bit. Yeah, A little bit.
Nick Petrella:Yeah.
Red Hot Anni:A little bit. Well, you know, actually, because I've been to Paris a couple of times to perform and every time I go there I go by the Moulin Rouge and I take a look at it and there is a little part of me, the little girl part of me, that's like, oh yeah, that's the, that's like the be all end all of this. But you know, one of the things I didn't know when I started to do burlesque, when I was doing regular theater, is that when you specialize in a um, in a specific arena, it's easier to get known for it. And so, all of my empathy, I've been invited to perform in all of these places and, um, you know, put up in a nice hotel somebody to drive me around the whole nine yards and really, really, I think it's about specializing and knowing what your niche, your niches, and and then connecting with the other people who are doing that art form.
Nick Petrella:That's good.
Red Hot Anni:And the burlesque scene. Even though it's quite large and expansive these days, it is also kind of small in a certain way.
Andy Heise:Right, yeah, a tight community yeah.
Red Hot Anni:Everybody knows everybody and especially when we were starting in 2007 and 2008 on MySpace and stuff like that, it was even tinier Because not everybody was brave enough to, let's say, make content.
Andy Heise:Right.
Red Hot Anni:Well, I imagine it's everywhere now yeah.
Andy Heise:And it was more difficult to create content. You had to be very intentional about it right, versus just pulling your phone out or whatever.
Red Hot Anni:Yeah, most definitely.
Andy Heise:So we've talked a little bit about some of the logistical challenges that you face. But balancing the business side, the administrative, the business side and the creative side, do you have a way that you kind of manage that or separate those tasks in your head? Do you do all of those administrative things or how's that work for you?
Red Hot Anni:You know, it's a this, to me, is like such a process question, because I think this is one of the things you have to figure out early on in in your art If you're going to be doing other things, where you're going to be putting things out in the public facing which we all are now, because we're not all just like artists who are for hire we all have to do administrative stuff, and so really part of the process was getting organized and and recognizing, like you only have 24 hours in a day and so at the beginning of my process, when I was first starting back in 2007, 2008, I would answer everything, I would do everything myself. I and I spend certain periods of time during the week really narrowly focused on whatever the task is at hand, and other times I really allow myself to be as free as possible, just put music on, just play and be spontaneous and, yeah, the balance of that is pretty, it's pretty important. It's really important because without, obviously, the creative thing, there's no point in doing the admin.
Andy Heise:Right.
Nick Petrella:What size are the houses that you play in, like how many audience members?
Red Hot Anni:They've ranged a lot Since 2020, the houses have been much smaller, but I think that's just because things haven't quite geared back up, if you will. Um, but I would say a typical house since 2020 has been between 60 to 70. Um, but before then we had a weekly show at um at stage seven, seven, three, that every week it would get 70 people. Uh, we would um, you know I would, when I would travel. There would be shows where there would be much bigger venues that would have several thousand people even. Um, it's, chicago is kind of a funny place because there's not a lot. There's a lot of very tiny venues and very, very big venues and not a lot of medium sized venues. So sometimes you're looking at either at 70 or 700 and there's not many venues that are in between.
Andy Heise:Yeah, Well, I think, to that point I think, I think that that sort of mid sized venue has always sort of had some issues. But I think, particularly coming back from the pandemic, we lost a lot of them and um, who knows if they'll come back.
Andy Heise:Yeah, yeah, I believe, I believe, yeah, yeah absolutely, yeah, I believe, I believe, yeah, yeah, absolutely, yeah. Those are, yeah, those are the places that most people, I think, enjoy going to right. They're not. They want to be part of a big crowd, but not too big of a crowd, and parking and stuff like that. Right, yeah, a little anonymity yeah. A little bit, yeah, yeah.
Nick Petrella:So, annie, other than your website and social media accounts, where else do you market your events and have any proven more effective than others?
Red Hot Anni:I'm a really big believer in word of mouth, so I do my. I have an email list and I really focus on trying to build connections through letting people know who I am and really be able to see into my heart and see, see who I am, um. And then you know my classes every week I, I same, I show up with those, I try to show up as much, a hundred percent myself as possible, um, and allow that reputation and the word of mouth to to build momentum, because it does in the word of mouth to build momentum, because it does.
Announcer:Thank you,
