Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast: Making Art Work
Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast: Making Art Work
#334: Christopher Erk (Dancer) (pt. 2 of 2)
Today we released part two of our interview with Los Angeles-based dancer, Christopher Erk. For 20 years he’s traveled the world as a professional tap dance performer, teacher, and choreographer. Most recently he has toured with Tap Dogs, Scott Bradlee's Postmodern Jukebox, and was a featured Artist in Las Vegas's number one show, Absinthe at Caesar's Palace.
In addition to his dancing, he’s the Founding Artistic Director of the Tap Factor, a production company that emphasizes the global implications of Tap Dance through all-inclusive workshops and performance opportunities that tour internationally throughout the year.
Make sure to check out Chris’s websites in the show notes to see him in action!
https://www.christophererk.com/home and https://www.youtube.com/@christophererk4848
Welcome to the Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast. Making art work. We highlight how entrepreneurs align their artistry, passion and vision to create and pursue opportunities to capture value in the arts. The views expressed by guests on the Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast are solely their own and do not necessarily represent the views of the podcast or its hosts. The appearance of a guest on the podcast, the venture they represent or reference to any product or service does not imply an endorsement or recommendation by the podcast or its hosts. The content provided is for entertainment and informational purposes only and does not constitute business advice. Here are your hosts Andy Heise and Nick Petrella.
Andy Heise:Hi Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast listeners. My name is Andy Heise.
Nick Petrella:And I'm Nick Petrella. Los Angeles-based dancer Christopher Erk is on the podcast today. Hi Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast listeners. My name is Andy Heise and I'm Nick Petrella. Los Angeles-based dancer Christopher Erk is on the podcast today. For 20 years, he's traveled the world as a professional tap dance performer, teacher and choreographer. Most recently, he has toured with Tap Dogs, Scott Bradley's postmodern jukebox, and was a featured artist in Las Vegas' number one show, Absinthe at Caesar's Palace. In addition to his dancing, he's the founding artistic director of the Tap Factor, a production company that emphasizes the global implications of tap dance through all-inclusive workshops and performance opportunities that tour internationally throughout the year. Christopher's websites will be in the show notes so you can learn more about him and see videos of his performances. Before we begin, I want to thank my friend, Amber Emery Mayer for introducing us to Christopher. Thanks for being on the podcast, Chris, Thanks for having me. You mentioned that you do a lot of this yourself, but I see online you have management. How much work do you get from management as opposed to what you do?
Christopher Erk:So essentially they represent me in my film and television work and they also represent me in their academic department. But I haven't caught on to any of their opportunities in their academic department because the type of work that they specialize in acquiring for dance teachers is not the kind of work that I have been doing or been interested in doing. But we have recently met about them taking on some tap factor stuff oh, okay good and the minute again.
Christopher Erk:This is one of these situations where I was like, oh yeah, and I got. Sometimes I get into conversations with people and I remember myself like why aren't we doing anything like this? So literally, yeah. So basically where I'm at right now with them is um sort of dusting off some of the, some of the content and the in the in the deliverable um package, just so we can get more of like a pitch deck together. Yeah, so they can have something that they can go. Yeah, yeah, mainly for corporate stuff. Sure to go do breakout sessions and um, get everybody on their feet and trying something new that they haven't done before with each other, sort of stuff like that.
Andy Heise:And having an agent for TV and film is kind of a necessity.
Christopher Erk:Yeah, yeah it is. It is because they get the breakdowns is what we call them. They get the opportunities that if you don't have an agent and you're out self-submitting for things, you wouldn't even know about it.
Andy Heise:Yeah, that makes sense. We've been talking a lot about sustainability of artistic projects and an artistic career in general, which is something that a lot of artists struggle with. How do they, you know, jumping, as you were kind of alluding to earlier jumping from gig to gig, you know, like, okay, I finished this one. What am I going to do next, which is difficult to sustain financially as well, as you know, psychologically, physically, those sorts of things, but relevant to the financial side, like with all of these different projects going on and that sort of thing, like how do you approach that financial sustainability? You know, are there just peaks and valleys and that's just how it is, or do you have some sort of regular sort of revenue streams, that kind of even out those peaks and valleys?
Christopher Erk:Yeah, I mean, when you do gig, gig-to-gig sort of situation, it does perpetuate itself and it ends up working itself out in the end. It's funny when I was younger this is more something we would say, but it's like, oh, I haven't auditioned in forever. It's just because one thing moves to the next thing, next thing and the next thing and the next thing. It just sort of like fills itself in. But yeah, um, I think there's this just idea of having your cake and eating it too. I mean it's, it's a trade-off, right.
Christopher Erk:If, if you want to work for yourself, you have to, um, understand that you may be jumping gaps, um, and having to take risks, um, or, yeah, I mean, you know, and I'm married and my wife and I we have different revenue streams where you know it doesn't really matter what those are, um, but we make things work right so we can continue to have the lifestyle and our hopes and dreams still generating our possibilities for us in the background. You asked me what I do for a living. I could probably tell you three different things right.
Christopher Erk:Depending on who I'm talking to. Yeah, so, um, you just, you find a way, you find a way. And I think again, like I'm at that point right now and it just seems to be a natural sort of balance of life where, um, in general, I'm looking to maybe hit the pavement less, yeah, to maybe hit the pavement less, yeah. Sure, not literally, because part of my acting and my film stuff is all about stunt acting and hitting the ground and training beam.
Andy Heise:But I think of it also as being able to say no to some opportunities right.
Christopher Erk:Yeah, like there's just, you know it's. The thing is, oddly enough, I'm kind of right in that cusp where it's like I'm not so commercial, right that I will, and this is probably because a lot to do with my contemporary conservatory training, um, is I'm not so commercial where I'll just do anything. I've had times where I would Sure, but I'm also not so not commercial that I would. You know what I'm saying? That I would just like I'm not doing that. No, no, no, I'm not doing that Because I know a lot of people who are tremendous talents that just I mean they won't conform in some way to do what they don't want to do.
Christopher Erk:Just for a check and I respect both sides Sure, right, I personally I fall bang in the middle and I think it's just because of how I was brought up and the environments I brought up. I had a very sort of formal conservatory style training but I also did do a lot of commercial, competitive dance as a kid. I just it's just the me, just it's dance, right, yeah, it's dance, it's another opportunity. It's the more the merrier. Where's the party at? I want to be there and that's why I think I've turned into sort of like a facilitator who can be in any circumstance yeah, yeah, and know how to dial into what buttons may make this crowd tick. Yeah, or what buttons makes this crowd tick, so I can be in a school in the morning and then be in a room full of suits in the afternoon and teach them the same exact thing. Yeah.
Nick Petrella:But that engagement that you're doing is so important.
Christopher Erk:It's really you know, and this is like, again, like just being at school and learning how to define what we're doing. You know, being at school and learning how to define what we're doing, you know the definitions of what I do, and every facilitation touches on the micro, the meta and the macro right, the micro being yourself, the meta being the group master of science. You know candidates right, and we're in the room and my friend, who is the professor of the class, is like a NATO conflict mediator, like he's in a helicopter in the afternoon and comes back two hours later for dinner. And it's like you can't tell me where you were, can? You's like no, let's go. You're going to the movies, right, but anyway. So this is this is like a definitely not an artistic group of people, right, but what I was doing is this. He saw the intrinsic nature of my work and saw the transferable attributes to what he's working on with his kids. So I walk in and I go.
Christopher Erk:First thing I ask is you are about to learn how to tap dance, how do you feel you're going to do? And I have you reflect, right, you're in the moment. Personal reflection. I have everybody write it down on a sticky note right, and they put it up on the wall. This is their manifested culture of their self-reflection of how they're going to do before the thing happens right. And then I ask them another question. I say dance has social implications. Tap dancing, and what you're about to learn, has social implications. What do you think those are? And they write those down and then you have the manifested idea of what the social implications are. And then I teach them and then I ask them the same questions again and then I have them do the same thing and you can literally see within an hour, from one to the next, how they have shifted their own self-perception and their own idea about how what they just did can be impactful in the world. And then to me that is the spark of the capacity and inspiration that one can have for themselves to approach anything new.
Christopher Erk:I think tap dance has interesting characteristics that it doesn't quite stem from something else. Like I can come in and maybe do like a writing exercise. Okay, we're going to do a writing exercise today and it's going to, we're going to help. But I've had so much writing experience in my life that I already have kind of like an embedded sense of an identity of who I am as a writer, how this is going to go. If I ask the same questions, you're about to learn how to write a poem right now, in this format, you might have a little bit more of an idea of how you're going to, because you just have more experience and testimony for it. Tap dance it's musical, yeah, but it's physical, yeah, and I've seen it on TV and it's actually kind of neat and cool, but it's also kind of not.
Andy Heise:I have to have special shoes.
Christopher Erk:Yeah, it's ambiguous, it's sort of like vague. People don't really get to have a real sort of informed idea on how to reflect on how they're actually going to do, so they usually just come up with. How do I usually do with new things in general, and if I can get them from one to the next moment to change or inspire them to do something that they didn't think that they would be able to do and actually succeed at it, that's just that's the work, that's the opportunity. So that's the micro right. And then the meta is they're all doing it together and you can have one person in one social standing and another person, another.
Christopher Erk:So it's it's like the show where the owner of the company goes into the kitchen of the restaurant. He's like, pretend you know, gets an idea of what you guys are doing, and then you know he's moved by it. Right, it's a similar thing. It's like you have all these people who have their own rankings already established, but then this is an opportunity to wipe that clean, an activity to bring everybody to a level playing field and gain a new sense of respect and understanding for each other as a group. And then now, as a group in unity, they have that relationship and then they can move forward to the world and make the world a better place.
Andy Heise:Yeah, what have you. And make the world a better place, yeah, what have you? To your point, the macro. They take that experience out into the world and use it in their work or in their personal lives, or whatever.
Christopher Erk:So that's literally the formula yeah, yeah, yeah.
Nick Petrella:You know you were joking around, but I was wondering do you supply tap shoes or they just do it in their? How does that work?
Christopher Erk:No, I don't, and that's the thing. Like that's the thing. You don't even need them. Um, I encourage hard soul like dress shoes because you know, a lot of times tap taps can sound abrasive and taps can make you feel it's like when you put um booties on a dog going out for the first time when you know they're in the snow. It's like you're trying to tell the dog just walk right, and that's the, that's the, that's the magic of all this. It's like you know. But I also teach from a uh, from a uh, an approach of practical movement and efficient movement. Yeah, so I try to get people to understand that tap dance.
Christopher Erk:I've never really brought up this conversation with tap dancers before, but I would love to have the idea of the conversation. The tap dancing, the actual tap dancing itself, the taps on the shoes and the steps you're doing, is the accessory, it's not the thing. So meaning, and I can talk about it like, like a shaolin monk. Right, you know, when they have a weapon, they don't look at it as my weapon is doing the thing, but my weapon is an extension of all of this right, my martial arts and um shifu always said I'm not going to teach you how to use a weapon. Until you've perfected your person right, people are like when are we gonna use the weapon?
Christopher Erk:So anyway, tap dancing as an accessory is literally an offset of what a lot of what we do on a daily. On a daily, uh, sure, as a daily routine, like when somebody's listening to music, they'll tap their foot right in time and it's, it's it's. They're not even conscious of really the fact that they're doing something physical and they're executing a thing. Right the minute you put a tap on the bottom of that foot, you're, you're tap dancing, you. And then the idea of tap dancing comes from the fact that I am like, what makes it tap dancing is the fact that you can reflect in your brain that I have a shoe on, I'm tapping my foot in time and just making a noise and you can hear it yeah that's the only thing that really like separates mindless sort of movements to.
Nick Petrella:I am doing it intention, yeah did I read that you play drums?
Christopher Erk:Yeah, I do have a percussive background. That's actually how I got started into dance.
Nick Petrella:It makes sense, right? I mean, it's just an implement. The shoes are just a different implement than a stick or a brush or whatever.
Christopher Erk:A hundred percent, a hundred percent.
Nick Petrella:Yeah, yeah, chris, I want to go back to the origin of the tap factor. Why and when did you decide it was time to start the production company, and did you have any surprises you hadn't anticipated, which?
Christopher Erk:is first or first Friday. Yeah, first Fridays. It's a popular thing that cities, especially revitalizing cities, do is the first Friday of every month. They have this big arts collaborative downtown and helps bring people to support downtown and arts and culture and stuff like that. So we needed to call ourselves something. So that's where I was like, well, this is a thing, and, yeah, we just called it the tap factor. Tap factors into to everything you know. Yeah, yeah, that's where the name came from. Um, but, yeah, I, it's because it was a thing.
Christopher Erk:It got to it. It wasn't just because we needed to call ourselves something, but it really was what we were. It really was what it is and as I moved forward, it stayed what it was. It stayed what it is and it just pretty much is like talking about accessories. It's an accessory to me, it's my work, it's what I do. It's a way to cut to the chase and rather than me have to necessarily say, oh, we can do this, this and this. No, it's, I can bring the tap factor with it. Here's the tap factor. Look at the website. This is what we do. Um, it's just it.
Christopher Erk:It needed it was, it needed an umbrella, because the thing about these, these sort of ideas, is that, you know, I only know my world too, and what I can learn in as much you know bandwidth that I may have, but for me I often had to articulate what it was that we're doing right To people who might not have experienced or participated in something similar to this point in their lives, right, so it's important to be able to, for me just not to always have to reinvent the wheel in some way. Right, it's just a way to sort of set a base for people to understand. Ah, ok, and then I can tailor. How do you fit into this Right? Now, you can see on the website too, you can see there are different iterations. There's the you know whether it's a school show or you know whatnot. Um and uh, or an uh in class session like a dance studio workshop or whatever. Um, yeah, it just helps. It helps. It helped to help people understand this sort of innovative approach to to what they're getting involved in.
Andy Heise:Yeah, and I think of it as you know, tap factors as a platform. It's not a product that you're buying, Like you're not buying the show or this. Even this type of specific show may maybe, but it's a. It's a platform where you bring people together to create something.
Christopher Erk:Yeah, oh, and jumping back to, we were talking about the shoes, the shoes, um the shoes. There are not shoes, but there can be.
Christopher Erk:And and I am hungry after the, the um the development of a product yeah that, like you know again, like for me, um, it's about taking, uh, it's about taking tab dance out of the dance studio and putting it in people's backyard, just like the basketball out of the. Yeah, you know, like everybody can buy a basketball hoop and throw it in. Or you go to a gym class and there's like 30 kickballs for everybody. Like, we got to have something that if I'm, if I'm having teachers in classrooms teaching their kids how to dance, if they did want to have that quick, oh, go to the cubby and grab the, the, the, the, whatever that is, that also needs to happen to it. But that's, that's part of the. The development of the programming and the sustainability of the program is actually having those things readily available, because a lot of the programs I've had we've actually had people sponsor actual tap shoes. But yeah, for the kids, but tap shoes are so expensive.
Andy Heise:So and and unitaskers right, they use them for yeah, yeah, um.
Christopher Erk:So was there a second part of the question before about, uh, why the tap factor evolved and I just wanted to know if you had any surprises you hadn't anticipated. Oh um I want to know the answer to this question too. Um any surprises I hadn't anticipated.
Nick Petrella:Um any surprises I hadn't anticipated.
Christopher Erk:I guess that's what a surprise is you know what, but I think that I think that you know. You know what sometimes surprised me. It's just how everything has worked out, whenever I have a vision for something and then I'll give you an actual surprise where this is. But everything that I've pitched the way that I do it, because it's so important, especially people are investing in the programming and their time and bringing other people on board and all that great stuff. Because I didn't always work with, like, small groups in my backyard, like it's like these are. I would work with big organizations. Right, they need to know what this is. Everything just always seemed to work out. It's because it's so planned, it's so I see it. Right, it's how I've always created anything like Like if somebody says, hey, can we do a show here, what would we do? I would always say I need to see the venue first before I have any idea what we're going to do, because the venue is the container and they're the parameters, they set the boundaries. It's like setting up the cones for a football match. You got to know where things start and finish and then I will let you know exactly what is going to happen. There is room for flexibility and for people, but there's so much self-expression within the format that the color comes, but it's got the bolts and nuts and bolts got it. So that's the surprising thing is how really functional everything has been. But I'll never forget I think I was getting you know this is, but this is where it can get shifty right. This is where you need to like be careful I and I can get emotional just thinking about the impact that this one experience had.
Christopher Erk:I was working with Best Buddies. Are you familiar with what Best Buddies is? Basically, it's an organization by Anthony Kennedy Shriver that is about helping raise awareness and opportunities for people with intellectual developmental disability, which is our defined, current best definition for autism. Um and uh, I just I can only say what I just said. That's what we call it. Um, you can do your research, but they create great opportunities and awareness and and partnerships, uh, people who might have or might not have. They bring them together and then develop. It's like and I don't think they enjoy this comparison, but it is the comparison of big brothers and big sisters, but with a mental illness component. And, if you know, sergeant Shriver's dad started the Peace Corps, as I understand and his mother started the Special Olympics, right? So these sort of bring these two ideas together and then you have best buddies, which is not just highlighting one ability, but the ability of all. They're all of the abilities being actual, like equal contributors to society, like, why not right? Which is so powerful? You have to involve yourself to really get a sense, or to understand what these relationships are and how powerful they can be. But how sort of? It's really great work and it's important work for the world to be able to understand. How, to understand how we all are equal. Yeah, no matter what our perceived abilities or capacities are, we all have a 100% life experience that we're going through and that should be valued and, and, um, respected. Um, yeah, we should all be treated equally for that.
Christopher Erk:But I would participate and perform at their annual concert at carnegie hall, which is a fun fundraiser for the new york chapter as an international organization, but they have chapters. And then this one year I was like, hey, let's get some of the buddies up on stage dancing, because I can teach anybody how to tap dance. I can get anybody on stage and in the drop of a hat, no time. Oh, what did you have in mind. Well, let's do a four-week program where we work with, and then within the chapters you have schools, right, each school has, like, their best buddies. Let's work with a particular organization or chapter within the chapter and we'll do a four-week program and I'll bring five people from New York who are not tap dancers, and then we'll have five people at the chapter that are not tap dancers. We'll build our tap boards. Which is part of the thing is you're building your own personal like tap board and then we'll pair everybody up and then we'll teach them how to tap dance with this improv idea and we'll do some structures. Pretty much you're showing, you're performing warmup exercises, but when you have kids, like it's like rudiments and drills, like watching them do it, it's like cool, um, and we're gonna do that great and we'll. You know, three weeks in there's this other fundraiser a run the best buddies run that they're doing out in long island. We can do a test performance at that Freaking awesome, cool. So before I do that, we also have some events in the city. Maybe, when it comes to the events, just to sort of get a sense of the community, and et cetera, et cetera.
Christopher Erk:I'll never forget when I walked into that dance the Best Buddies dance at this school I all of a sudden was terrified, absolutely terrified, that I wasn't going to be able to pull this off because of just attention. It does require format and attention to some degree, right, and I was terrified for a few minutes Because I don't know how long this lasted. I don't even know if it lasted all the way up until the first day where we went out and actually did the program, the first of four days. But I'm happy I did it. But it's possible that it might not have worked out, given the information that I had about the world I was getting myself involved in due to the magnitude of the promise that I offered.
Christopher Erk:I think you have to be very careful about how you do these sorts of things. And again, I don't want to say I necessarily got lucky, but what happened? And I get goosebumps all over my body when I think about this. It enriched my program by helping me understand even more how applicable the work is that I was doing and how flexible it is and its method of application by simply listening to your constituents who you're administering this programming to. And I became so present and I have parents sitting there watching Right. Yeah, each participant had a different spectrum, yep, and where they fell on it, as did we all. We all have a spectrum that we fall on. All I did was be fun. Um, all I did was present, be present, cause I knew what I was doing, I knew how, I knew my craft, but I, if I had to know it, well, yeah, I had to know it Well it became.
Christopher Erk:I. I had to know it. Well, it became. I can do this entire thing, and this is where it's great. This is where talk about other programs that I hadn't brought up yet. I can do this without talking. I can hold attention and I could get people to be productive, into trying something entirely new without saying a single word for a really long period of time. So where does this go?
Christopher Erk:There's no language barrier yeah right, I've been in Germany and there's stuff floating around online. Of all this stuff, the news came and the interviews, and I speak a little German. I have experience in Germany, but not enough to like I said, I've been on stage in front of hundreds, thousands of people, like everybody you know, like corporate team building, sort of like, or on television or interviews or radios or whatever. I know how to talk and I can flow right. But here I am in Germany with an hour, two hours, two different classes teaching them this tap dancing stuff, and I didn't even know their language. And an hour later the entire school came and we performed for them and the audience participated. And I did the same thing in Taiwan. I was there on tour with Tap Dogs, right, and we do press where we're going to schools and we're performing, right, and the guys in the cast, they know that I do this stuff.
Andy Heise:Right.
Christopher Erk:All of a sudden, I'm in Taiwan with everybody on their feet bringing volunteers. I don't speak Taiwanese, but we did it, so it's a sort of effect of being put under pressure and being vulnerable and putting myself out there and trying something new, believing in myself. But that that, uh, that one moment at that dance. I'll never forget it, because I usually in my life and in my career pretty much have my act together, yeah, yeah, where I'm, like I can handle this, I got this. I just really not much that pressure that I've been put under that I haven't put under before. Really, how bad can it be? Even if it's not great, it's still like we got through it right, sure, through it, right, sure, um.
Christopher Erk:But this fear, um, and then what it turned into and what I learned more and how applicable it became after that um is, is pretty, pretty, pretty intense. But again, I don't know, like, what do you do? That's the question I have to ask. What do you do? Do you, do you take the risk or do you not Right, like, even if I had an idea and that's kind of the idea being flexible I had an idea of how this was going to go Right. It may not have gone that way. It may actually have, though. I just still was nervous, but in a loud way, an informed way, based on the presence of the people involved, in all parties being there and open. It involved that to help understand a whole new avenue and idea about how this could go. Yeah, yeah.
Andy Heise:So, chris, as an entrepreneurial artist, how do you personally define success, and has that changed over time?
Christopher Erk:I think it's changed over time. I think a lot of you know when I first started as a dancer, even as a kid, the idea was to become something that everyone else understood was the success, and most mostly from people who weren't doing the same thing themselves that they perceived you to do. So they have their own idea about what it is to be that and they encourage you to be. You go do that, um, and then you. We will all be proud of you for that.
Andy Heise:It's like valid validation. Yeah, okay, now I see. Now I understand what you're doing. Yeah um.
Christopher Erk:But now, success for me is um, it's just being able to spark some sort of inspiration and somebody that allows them to get a refreshed sense of who they are in the world and what they're capable of, so they can continue to grow.
Nick Petrella:Great, cool, yeah. Before we get to our final three questions, I just have a question about performance or performing. Live performances are rarely perfect, so I'm wondering how hard are you on yourself after a performance? So do you let mistakes roll off your back, or or do they gnaw at you for a little while?
Christopher Erk:I, I, I, they, I, I, they gnaw at me. I have a really hard time If things don't go really well within my own reflection. Yeah Right, but that's what therapy is for. To be honest, um, you know, we all have a life experience and um and uh, sometimes that life experience could be the point where there can be trauma and that trauma can work its way into our own self-reflection.
Christopher Erk:Just in general, and um, being able to acknowledge that sort of stuff and do the work I think is very helpful when it comes down to knowing that your perception is not necessarily the reality of what is actually being received, that your perception is not necessarily the reality of what is actually being received. So that's been important because, especially when you're so passionate about what you do and it means so much to you, if something doesn't go right, it's going to really so much not go right and be so much wrong because that's just. You know, maybe, how some of your programming, my personal programming, would allude to. It's like, okay, if it's not right, then there's something wrong with myself. Right, and to know that the world isn't a perfect place and it doesn't have to be, it never will be, to know that that's okay is important to be able to let that go. You know, like I also do photography and you know you usually only see one or two photos from a set, right, right, but the hardest part is throwing away 80 amazing photos. It's also good training In Shaolin Kung Fu, which is part of my background.
Christopher Erk:There's an idea of flattening your heart. The idea of flattening your heart is to not become too attached to things, is to not become too attached to things just to move forward and be able to keep continually speaking more things and to sharpen your blade even more and to understand that pain is a part of life, it's part of the flavor that we get to experience and it's also a gift. So I've had some good advocacy and inspiration and mentorship. That has helped me get through those things. But yeah, it's difficult Because that's what people are coming to see the good stuff.
Christopher Erk:They're there to see you put your heart on the line and the reason why they're paying you to do it or they want to see you do it is because they don't have it within themselves to do the same thing, to do the same thing. So I think it's acceptable to feel deeply, but also to know that it's all process is the product. I'm a process is the product sort of person I like to get wonky, because then I get to reflect and see the progress and I can be proud of that.
Andy Heise:Yeah, well, chris, we've reached the rapid fire question part of the interview. These are three questions we ask all of our interviewees, and the first question is what advice would you give to others wanting to become an arts entrepreneur?
Christopher Erk:Just know that the novelty wears off.
Christopher Erk:I think that sorry, just can I click and you're probably going to do this, but the novelty of the novelty of when you see something in the distance, that pot of gold and that sort of that, that moment, by the time you've arrived there, you've done all the work that permits you, you've done all the work to understand that you actually like, yeah, of course I've landed here. It's not as fascinating anymore. So just get used to the idea of you know, and life can still be great and you can still smile and still love it and be fully present and enjoy your life. But these peaks and valleys for me aren't really there. So so much.
Christopher Erk:I have high points and like there are these things where you're like, oh, I don't know how I'm going to get through that. But again, like the step-by-step, the day-by-day, by the time you get to these goals or achievements, these milestones, you're kind of like you're already moving on to the like you're already thinking the milestone pin just keeps shifting ahead. You never really like get to that milestone and then, okay, so what's my next milestone? Boom, it's. You're always eking ahead, so I wouldn't necessarily. It's like chasing the pot of gold, right, it's, it's yeah. So just be careful when it comes down to the, the reason and purpose why you're doing, why you're doing it. Are you doing it to get off on the feeling of success?
Nick Petrella:because I think that that is something that is a bit of an illusion what can we do to ensure the arts are more accessible and reaching the widest possible audience?
Christopher Erk:stay local, local, local. Don't worry about the audience, the audience being global, global, global, because that's the thing it's like local, fair, right. If you want to go and you want to try something, some unique dish, don't figure out how to make it and take from over there. Go over there and have it, be inspired and bring that back home and use that inspiration to create things from the fabric, from where you are right.
Christopher Erk:I think that's the problem is, I think that people seek validation way too far away rather than really making rich, genuine opportunities and enjoying, just and savoring the flavor of where they come from.
Christopher Erk:It's like I want to create something so I can leave and give it there and give it there and give it there like it's. It's counterintuitive, right, and I think it's just really. I think it's really important because because, again, like I've traveled all over the world and I've done all these really amazing things and, trust me, it's an amazing opportunity and privilege that I've been able to do that. But I just keep getting back to the fact that, whether I'm spending an amazing time with you here in my backyard or an amazing time with you on the other side of the world and a different backyard, um, it's still an amazing time, and I think it's just important for people to look inward. It's a very big conversation, but I think, yeah, reach your own audience, find out who you are, and you can yeah, I think understand more about yourselves anyway that way, because then you can maybe turn into me, where you're like oh, I'm over here and I'm over here, and I'm over here, and I'm over here and I'm over here.
Christopher Erk:It's like, you know, a rolling stone yeah you, can you, can it, can it, can it, can it can backfire, thinking that it's over there, I've got to expand out, or it's for the money. Why? What are you going for out there, and is the value really intrinsically in line with the intentions of why it all started? Anyway, that's what I'm saying Great programming, local programming, rich programming, relationships are being developed. Now, what I want to learn how to make capital from that, and all I what I'm going to have to do is I'm going to have to leave my pod, within which this was all formed, and start to focus that energy outward. And, uh, it's going to be counterintuitive to the work. That's an idea, yeah.
Andy Heise:Yeah, last question what's the best artistic?
Christopher Erk:or entrepreneurial advice you've been given. Stick to what you know, stick to what? Stick to what you know, I think you know. For me, it was good advice that was given to me, but I didn't necessarily take it because, again, like, sometimes you think it's going to be different with you, right? Oh, like, stick to what you know and listen to the people who've been there, you know, like I know, I'm not a manager. I have leadership qualities but not management qualities, and I know that there's a difference between the two. Right, but what have I done? And what has burdened me the most is managing. Yeah, being a manager it's not necessarily just logistical work, right, right, it's how you convey and should just be able to just know what you do, stay in your lane and respect the opinions of people who have already been there.
Nick Petrella:That's great. Yeah, that's great. It's been great having you on the podcast and I really liked hearing how you capitalize on your circumstances to grow your company and make the most of your opportunities.
Christopher Erk:Thanks for having me A lot of fun. Thanks, Chris.
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