#373: Marianna Bednarska (Percussionist) (pt. 1 of 2)

This week on the podcast is part one of our interview with Polish percussionist, Marianna Bednarska. She’s a soloist, chamber musician, orchestral musician and teacher.  

Among her many accolades, she’s performed throughout Europe and the US, and has appeared as a soloist at the Lucerne Festival, the Davos Festival and with ensembles such as the Orchestre de la Suisse Romande and the Polish Radio Orchestra 

In addition to her professional experiences, Marianna has won prizes in over two dozen music competitions, including the Geneva International Music Competition, the Swiss Young Soloists, and she was a finalist in the Polish Eurovision Young Musician of the Year in 2009. 

Tune in to hear Marianna’s creative approach to pursuing opportunities throughout her career. https://mariannabednarska.com/en/home/

Transcript

Nick Petrella 0:03

Hi everyone, Nick Petrella here. This episode is sponsored by Steve Weiss Music, percussion specialist since 1961. If you're looking for a rare piece of sheet music, a specialty gong, or anything percussion, Steve Weiss Music will have it. Please visit Steveweissemusic.com or click their link in the show notes. That's S-T-E-V-E, W-E-I-S-S-Music.com, our percussion series sponsor.

Announcer 0:55

Welcome to the Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast, Making Art Work. We highlight how entrepreneurs align their artistry, passion, and vision to create and pursue opportunities to capture value in the arts. The views expressed by guests on the Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast are solely their own and do not necessarily represent the views of the podcast or its hosts. The appearance of a guest on the podcast, the venture they represent, or reference to any product or service does not imply an endorsement or recommendation by the podcast or its hosts. The content provided is for entertainment and informational purposes only and does not constitute business advice. Here are your hosts, Andy Heise and Nick Petrella.

Andy Heise 1:38

Hi Arts Entrepreneurship Podcast listeners. I'm Andy Heise.

Nick Petrella 1:41

And I'm Nick Petrella. Joining us on the podcast is Polish percussionist Marianna Bednarska. She's a soloist, chamber musician, orchestral musician, and teacher. Among her many accolades, she's performed throughout Europe and the U.S. and has appeared as a soloist at the Lucerne Festival, the Davos Festival, and with ensembles such as the Orchestra de la Suisse Remonde, the International Chamber Orchestra of Washington, and the Polish Radio Orchestra. In addition to her professional experiences, Marianna has won prizes in over two dozen music competitions, including the Geneva International Music Competition, the Swiss Young Soloists, and she was a finalist in the Polish Eurovision Young Musician of the Year in 2009. We'll have Mariana's website in the show notes so you can read more about her career and hear excerpts from her performances.

Marianna Bednarska 2:30

Hello, thank you so much for having me. It's a great pleasure.

Nick Petrella 2:35

I mentioned some of your career highlights in the introduction, so why don't you tell us a bit more about yourself?

Marianna Bednarska 2:41

Thank you so much for the introduction. I'm a classical percussionist based in Warsaw, Poland, where I also grew up here and my musical education began here. For several years, I studied piano, and my big fascination with the art of classical percussion instruments and their colors, their energy, and unendless sound possibilities made me fall in love with this word immediately. And I think that curiosity about sound is still the main driving force in what I do today. And classical percussion is a very special field because it constantly moves between different musical words. And I'm very interested not only in performing existing repertoire but also on developing new works with composers and expanding these possibilities of all percussion instruments. And my concerts, recordings, or masterclasses have taken me to many wonderful places around the world and allowed me actually to collaborate with inspiring personalities. So in recent years, um, another very meaningful part of my work has become teaching and uh passing this knowledge and inspiration to the next generation of percussionists. So it feels like a natural continuation of my own musical journey.

Nick Petrella 4:02

Oh, that's wonderful. And it's basically a synopsis of what we're going to be unpacking today.

Andy Heise 4:07

Yeah.

Marianna Bednarska 4:08

Yes.

Andy Heise 4:09

Was there um like your early influences on classical music or getting into music in general? Did you have family involved? Or how did you become introduced to that world?

Marianna Bednarska 4:21

Well, of course, my whole family um is musical family, and a very, very funny thing was that my aunt, who is now 91, uh, she's also a percussionist, and she invited me to the percussion concert. And I was so um really inspired, and there were so many instruments, so many uh people moving, not only standing by the instruments, but there was so much energy and this movement and the general atmosphere that made me fall in love immediately with this instrument. So from one day to another, I just said to my parents that right now I'm gonna be a percussionist, and I dropped the piano.

Nick Petrella 5:00

Yeah. Ah, very good. Yeah. A lot of movement on stage and even more movement before and after.

Marianna Bednarska 5:07

Yes.

Nick Petrella 5:08

Just different kind, different kind.

Andy Heise 5:11

Oh, right. Yeah, you kind of have to uh embrace the um the equipment movement and and storage and and and all of that uh as part of part of being a percussionist.

Marianna Bednarska 5:25

Exactly. With so many instruments, we have so much space and so much gestures, we can use our body, our voice. Uh it's really an endless discovery, and I think that's what's the most inspiring in percussion today.

A YouTube Video Sparks A Recording

Andy Heise 5:39

Yeah, sure. Wonderful. Yeah, yeah. Um, I was reading reading up on you in preparation for this, and um I read that you were the first percussionist to record uh Anders Koppel's uh complete set of marimba concertos, which is fascinating. Um, how did that project come about and and what made it feel like you know the right moment to commit to doing that project?

Marianna Bednarska 6:02

Yes, this beautiful recording project actually came about in a very unexpected way. When I was still at the music school in Warsaw, I was invited to perform a Marimba concerto with the school orchestra. And after this concert, my father just uploaded the recording on YouTube. And to my great surprise and happiness, of course, the composer himself contacted me saying that um he had been very impressed by the performance, and he told me that he could imagine uh me as the soloist for a recording of all of his four Marimba concertos. And wow uh yeah, and I remember very clearly how meaningful that moment was for me. And of course, working with someone who created the music offers as performance a completely new perspective, and suddenly I understood you know the intentions, the imagination, the emotional background behind this, all of these notes. And I have to say that there was never really like um a moment that I asked myself, should I do it or what's the plan now? I just simply followed this love for marimba, for of course other percussion instruments and for this music, and also certain sense of mission to bring the percussion repertoire to the wider audience. And um, I think that the marimba is extremely um rich and expressive instrument with a huge palette of colors, and I have felt a certain responsibility to share it more broadly. And of course, Anders Koppel and this great team like Olborg Symphony Orchestra, uh conductor Henrik van Christensen and Preben Ivan, who recorded the concertos, it was truly meaningful and extraordinary experience for me.

Andy Heise 7:53

Yeah, I bet. Did you have experience recording before? Was that your first big recording project as well?

Marianna Bednarska 8:00

Yes, that was uh very first huge recording project. Of course, I had a chance to record with the students of music university before for their classes, so they asked me several times, but that was something very new, and also I was standing in front of the orchestra, so um also I was not alone, and the experience was much more rich and demanding.

Nick Petrella 8:23

Yeah, yeah, I can imagine. Yeah. I think that's pretty fascinating. And you know, as a musician, I'm wondering about I've always thought that when you work with composers, it's if you can understand the construction, you can understand the theory better, which is you know the deconstruction, essentially. Did you find that? Or has has that experience changed your approach to playing?

Playing For Composers Versus Class

Marianna Bednarska 8:45

Absolutely, because as we stay in the classroom and we work with ourselves, uh generally at the very beginning, you know, with our teachers, we trust them and we just follow their instructions. And I was doing that. I just was realizing the notes and of course feeling the music. So there was this technical artistic aspect. But somehow, while working with this composer or now with another composer, I feel there is another perspective. There is not only the technique, but there is so much more to say about the music generally, and even like a very small phrase or uh some interval or whatever happens in the piece that has a big, big meaning. And on the top of that, with your own interpretation, you create uh just a new dimension in the music. So that's something fantastic, and I think it improves so much the uh in the artistic language that we are speaking in the music.

Nick Petrella 9:41

Yeah, it's wonderful. I recently asked this next question to a concert pianist we uh we interviewed, who, like you, he's had a lot of success in music competitions. Do you prepare and perform differently for competitions as opposed to performances?

Competitions Versus Concert Mindset

Marianna Bednarska 9:57

Yeah, that's a very interesting question because competitions and concerts create quite a different psychological environment. And in the competition, you are of course aware that our performance is being evaluated in a very analytical way and that this aspect um influences the way musicians prepare. The preparation tends to be extremely detailed and very focused on on the precision on or control, and I think that the greatest danger here is the temptation to become you know too focused on perfection or trying to play just for the expectations of the jury. So that can be quite misleading, I think, because music cannot exist only as something technically perfect. And I always felt that um my most convincing competition performances happen when I manage to forget that it really is a competition and instead of approach it as a true musical experience. And in a concert, for example, the primary goal is a communication. So you play for the audience and for the music itself, and in competitions there is naturally more pressure, but in my experience, the result um is the best when I try to perform uh and transform this situation into something closer to a concert, so where the focus is on expression and storytelling and sharing the music. And in the end, I think the jury respond the most uh strongly to the authenticity and individual musical language. So at the same time, of course, I think competitions are a great opportunity to learn, to deal with repertoire, the to gain the experience on stage and build connections, and that's that's really fantastic, and it opens the doors to new collaborations, concerts, and I think just this perspective of the concert, the storytelling, that's something that uh was brought into my preparations and the performances during the competition.

Nick Petrella 12:03

Yeah. Well, with the success you've had, clearly that that works. Yeah.

Marianna Bednarska 12:08

Thank you.

Andy Heise 12:12

So when you look at some of the choices that that that you've made or that that have been made that have sort of defined your career trajectory, how much of that was you know self-directed versus um you know guidance from other people who maybe took an interest in in what you were doing? Like the the Maremba recording is a perfect example of you know you you played a performance, but then someone else came in and said, Hey, you should you should you should record these for me.

Marianna Bednarska 12:39

Right.

Andy Heise 12:40

Uh versus you going out and and creating those opportunities for yourself.

Marianna Bednarska 12:44

Yes, exactly. When I look back at my artistic path, it's like with the CD. So I had the feeling that many things shape themselves in a very natural way, actually. I never approached my career like something that I need to carefully calculate or you know, strategically design, um, neither by myself nor by others, but most of my artistic uh opportunities developed in such a way that uh particular experience opened a space for new possibilities. And looking back, it almost feels like uh as if each experience has its own place and meaning within a bigger picture. And at the same time, I can say that following my passion and love for percussion instruments has probably been the most important form of this self-direction in my career. And um the same time, at the same time, we are all shaped by the people that we meet, also other artists, teachers, colleagues, and these experiences we have, uh both artistic ones, and of course, those that are not strictly musical, um, but still they influence the way we think and perceive the world. And in my uh opinion, all of these encounters enrich us and shape the choices. And um this, all these situations they help me understand more clearly what kind of voice I want to develop into the music. And I think every experience becomes a tool and an opportunity along this path that we take. The important thing is to remain open and always curious and to learn how to use these tools to share your artistic mission in the most uh I think honest and meaningful way. So for me, um it has always been essential to remain in harmony with my intuition and with myself, trusting this you know, inner compass. And the best uh becomes this combination of dedication and curiosity and a certain sense that life places us in the right uh moments. And ultimately all of those experiences find their reflections in the music we share.

Andy Heise 14:57

Yeah. So it's kind of if I hear you uh correctly, it's it's it's you're kind of making decisions that the best decisions for for the next move, and then that sort of evolves into new opportunities, maybe that you couldn't have even imagined before. Um, but based on that that experience that opens up additional uh opportunities for for whatever it is uh you're doing.

Career Growth Through Openness

Marianna Bednarska 15:22

Yes, exactly, exactly. And the context and the people, this is so important. So every event that happens naturally in the same time is somehow directed by others, by opportunities, by uh artists. So it's all I think comes together.

Nick Petrella 15:39

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, and speaking of opportunities, you have performances around the world, and I think recently you got, didn't you just get back from Hong Kong?

Marianna Bednarska 15:48

Exactly, yes, that's true.

Nick Petrella 15:50

Yeah. So do you arrange those performances yourself, or do you do it through management or some other means? How are those arranged?

Marianna Bednarska 15:58

Well, in my case, uh most of my projects actually develop quite directly. I do not currently work with a personal manager, so many invitations come to me through festivals, concert halls, orchestras, collaborations with other musicians, or through relationships that that developed over time. And the musical world is very much built on this artistic connection. So quite often a project grows naturally out of a previous performance, as we said, or a festival appearance or collaboration with musicians, even with the composers, like in the case of the CD. And this is very organic how it develops. And at the same time, during different stages of my career, uh, what was very important for me, I had this opportunity to meet and learn from promoters and managers working with several competitions, like Geneva competition, for example, with orchestras or artistic agencies. And even if some of these encounters were sometimes relatively brief, they gave me a very valuable insight into the another perspective of the musical world. So how projects are shaped, how they are presented, developed from the organizational side. And um, in so many ways, my propositions came through a combination of these personal relations and invitations that grow uh from previous collaborations.

Nick Petrella 17:30

Now, have you thought about getting a manager or working with management, or is that just a part of the value chain that you can do yourself and you're just gonna keep?

Marianna Bednarska 17:40

Of course, I have these thoughts, and uh I think this is a very natural part of us artists that we have so much to do every day, and we manage our emails and practice and the life, and we want to be supported. However, I'm I think I learned through this many, many years how to manage this, and I'm very grateful for the situation uh as I have it now, and I learned so much, so I know I can rely on myself.

Nick Petrella 18:08

Perfect. And and that's I and I liked asking that for musicians and other artists who uh who may be listening.

Marianna Bednarska 18:17

Yes, yes, yes, uh, yes.

Choosing Collaborations And Logistics

Andy Heise 18:20

Well, I was gonna ask this question later, but it seems appropriate right now. How do you how do you decide which, particularly collaborative projects, um, how do you decide which collaborative projects you you want to work on? How do you what makes you decide to say yes to a collaborative project?

Marianna Bednarska 18:36

Well, because I feel such a strong desire to share this procussion world with audiences, I try to remain very open really to many different kinds of artistic projects. So procussion offers really a huge landscape of that solo recital, chamber music, orchestral collaboration, and you know, the premiere of new work, uh, recording projects, masterclass, and many, many more. And um I think I I strongly believe that every um each of these contexts allows us to use, you know, to discover something very, very new. And of course, um there are in practice uh concrete factors that shape whether a project can actually happen. And in my case, this involves large and complex instrument setup or very practical aspects such as transportation, the availability of instruments, the acoustics of the venue, or the amount of space, for example. So sometimes there are also artistic ideas that are very inspiring in principle. For example, when a composer proposes a piece for a certain instrument, but in practice the work may function within a very specific instrumental setup that makes it difficult to realize in a particular context. So um that might not be possible in that case. Or another important element in my case is my regular teaching position at the university, and simply some of those dates can always not cannot always be realized. And of course, in you know, in every profession that involves uh very close collaboration between people, so there are more uh challenging moments sometimes, of course, with the communication and and artistic expectations, and with some people it simply happens that everyone continues their path in a different direction. So the several situations I think they really matter in that case, but generally I really stay focused because I want to develop and I want to try all of these different things, especially with my instruments.

Andy Heise 20:42

Sure. So there's practical considerations, but also sort of the the um you know your own sort of artistic aspirations that go into making those decisions.

Marianna Bednarska 20:54

Absolutely, yes.

Andy Heise 20:55

Yeah.

Nick Petrella 20:57

Talking about the music business, what do you know now about it that you wish you knew when you first started your career?

Marianna Bednarska 21:05

I think that uh percussion field still remains relatively young field within the world of classical music. And um comparing to instruments such as the violin or the piano, uh, the tradition of percussion repertoire is much stronger, and in many ways it is still actively being shaped. And uh, I think we also become, in a sense, curators of this field, and it becomes important to present percussion from many different perspectives, interdisciplinary projects or new commissions. And when developing artistic projects, one also learns that it is essential to articulate a clear artistic idea, um, such as meaningful concept or a narrative or something distinctive and authentic that captures uh the interest of presenters, of uh promoters. And collaborators and gives the project its unique identity. And over time, I realized that the career in music is not built only on this artistic preparation. And of course, the artistic depth remains the foundation, but professional world of music also involves many other dimensions that we are not always taught during our studies. And I think that the communication and relationships play a fundamental role. The way we collaborate with promoters, orchestras, colleagues, institutions, it is so important as the performance itself and also trust and long-term artistic relationships. This is frequently becoming the foundation for future opportunities, yes. So it is not that I regret not knowing these things earlier. And to me, it is uh life itself that reveals them, you know, gradually through experience. But I do believe it is valuable for young musicians to become aware of these dimensions early on and to remain open, curious, resilient, and to have this courage to pursue what they truly believe in.

Nick Petrella 23:12

So it sounds like a lot of what we talk about on the podcast, plus the technical and musical aspects, but the third dimension that you mentioned in there, you're actually promoting the genre of percussion.

Andy Heise 23:22

Right.

Marianna Bednarska 23:23

Yes, exactly.

Nick Petrella 23:24

Yeah.

Andy Heise 23:25

That's interesting. Well, and I love your I love your use of the word uh curatorial or curation, the curation of the repertoire that you develop over your career and over your time. Um it becomes sort of kind of an identity, right? And and that can either just kind of happen because you got invited to do something, or like we've been talking about, you can intentionally seek out those types of uh opportunities that sort of help you shape that that curatorial um uh approach to your to your repertoire.

Marianna Bednarska 23:58

Right, yes. And I think that we are such a young discipline comparing to another instrument that percussion has its, let's say, golden age now, and we live in um creating a history because it's like we would work with uh Mozart or or Brahms, then we are working with the composers now and we create this whole repertoire. So I think it's so fascinating.

Nick Petrella 24:21

Right, yeah, yeah, absolutely. When you think of some of the instruments we're playing on, they didn't really become standardized until the early 1900s. Keyboard instruments, right?

Marianna Bednarska 24:31

Yes, and there are still new instruments coming. Yeah, so we don't know what what is uh going to happen, but I think this is very, very beautiful, yeah.

Nick Petrella 24:41

Yeah, various.

Andy Heise 24:44

It's not it's not a question. I don't think this comes up in our conversation later, but I I what I was uh struck by with watching some of your performances and things is is the use of your voice. That's not a common in my experience, it's not a common um addition uh to a to a concert uh percussionist.

Marianna Bednarska 25:02

Yes, right. There are so many pieces now with you know new technologies, with the theatrical aspects, with the objects, gestures. Um I think every instrument can be not only percussion, but it can be like a piece of tool from the garage or piece of uh building or paper or the kitchen jar. So everything can be used as the percussion, and we having these body possibilities. We can not only walk, we can dance, we can move using our voice also, like screaming or uh whispering, or just using the face. So there is so much to say, and also with the other artists, not only musicians, but painters or dancers. Yeah, this is really fascinating.

Nick Petrella 25:47

Absolutely. Yeah, you know, as as Andy asked that question, I immediately thought of there are some French ensembles, quartet coup. I don't even know if they're still in existence, but quarter beat. Have you ever seen them? Of course. With their stage production, yeah. Yeah, that would be fun to have on.

Marianna Bednarska 26:03

Yeah, yeah. It's very I think it's very captivating for the audience, and people really enjoy, they really love um this with combination uh with percussion, especially. Yeah.

Andy Heise 26:15

Yeah, I I fully um acknowledge my probably lack of um experience uh watching and viewing and uh familiarity with percussion performances. But um again, to your point, there's always there's something new in some that any ensemble or any artist could could bring to that that type of a performance, given the the total number of possibilities with with percussion.

Marianna Bednarska 26:39

Yes, absolutely.

Nick Petrella 26:40

Well, to your point though, it is uncommon.

Andy Heise 26:44

Yeah, yeah.

Nick Petrella 26:46

Yep.

Teaching The Business Behind Music

Andy Heise 26:48

Um and so as we've been discussing your your active uh in solo performances and chamber music, orchestral works, and uh as you also mentioned teaching, uh we're gonna talk about that a little bit later as well. Um is that a deliberate balance that you that you sought out, or did that sort of come, did it sort of shape itself gradually as you were progressing through your career?

Marianna Bednarska 27:12

Of course, uh in this context of classical procussion, my activity is very, very rich because uh we have many roles, I think, as a percussionist. We are soloists, we stand uh in front of the orchestra, behind the orchestra, we have to pass this knowledge to the other musicians and uh at the same time being a soloist. So also I think it depends a bit of uh what I'm doing here with the percussion instruments that I have to be um ready for as diverse activity as possible. Uh, and I think just this balance somehow creates itself naturally, and it's how it happens uh in my career, on my path, and I'm very grateful for that because I can also be prepared for the future challenges, and um, it gives me sort of creativity also and it broadens my ideas. And you can learn so much from either very classical concert and very classical playing, really being a triangle player or a timpani player with other musicians, or making a completely new instrument in the contemporary ensemble and um or even not using any instrument at all. So there is so much to discover, and this um balance just comes naturally in this artistic activity.

Andy Heise 28:35

Yeah. Do you and you don't you don't have to have an answer for this, but do you find one more artistically uh fulfilling solo performance, ensemble performance, teaching?

Marianna Bednarska 28:46

Oh, I don't have really like a specific answer. That's true, but what I can tell, I they are very complementary. So if I am teaching, I uh bring this also on stage. So I look totally different on my performance, uh like being a soloist during the recital when I teach. And what I do on the stage, I bring for my um students. So this is really fantastic. They are all uh equally important for me.

Nick Petrella 29:14

Yeah, yeah. The real answer is if the students are prepared, then it's enjoyable.

Marianna Bednarska 29:21

Yeah, and and actually it's a question if we feel prepared. And I also asked myself during the competitions and all of the stories when I was having exams, or you know, the situation when I have to prove myself if there is really a moment that I can say, okay, I'm ready. And I think it's never never arrived. So maybe maybe that's life of an artist. Yeah.

Nick Petrella 29:44

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think so. Can always always be better, yeah.

Marianna Bednarska 29:48

Yeah.

Nick Petrella 29:49

You know, you recently secured a uh teaching position at the Chopin University of Music in Warsaw. And since you are a performing musician and deal, as we've said, we you deal with the business of music on a regular basis, contracts, negotiations, and so on. Do you bring that content into the classroom so students know what to expect in the real world, just beyond striving to be great musicians?

Marianna Bednarska 30:13

Yes, so during our studies, we naturally focus, of course, on developing artistic and technical skills. And this professional reality of a musician also includes so many other dimensions, like collaborations and communications and project development and understanding how the musical world functions in practice. And I always try to raise awareness of these aspects as well in my class. And in a way, I often feel I become not only a teacher, but also some someone taking care of young artists, which is wonderful. And I try to create opportunities that help them enter the professional world more consciously. So, for example, by uh creating international collaborations at the university or developing original um artistic ideas, creating joint projects with other professors, ensembles, or or guest musicians from abroad, or like even the simple practical elements, like when you have to go and really negotiate the possibilities for buying instruments or gaining more space for logistical conditions. So all of this is involved there, and this is the part of my communication. And I try to support the class also with the visibility because I think um yeah, it is very essential to go out also, not only for this real world, but in this digital aspect. And at the same time, I see my role as not only helping students become excellent musicians, but also helping them discover their own artistic direction and courage to ask questions. What kind of music do I want to share? Uh, what kind of message do I want to communicate? And um, how can I find the courage to pursue that that path with conviction? And of course, this relationship I think works uh both ways. So working with students for me is incredibly inspiring, but um their energy, their curiosity, and this sense of being musician as a teacher, it becomes very beautiful and I think like a like a mutual collaboration.

Nick Petrella 32:30

Yeah, yeah, that's good getting them involved.

Marianna Bednarska 32:34

Absolutely.

Andy Heise 32:37

Yeah, I I feel like we we don't do them any favors by not getting them involved in those types of even if it's administrative, like like you were talking about negotiating space and things like that. Like it's a disservice to not let them be a part of that because that's the reality of of doing it outside of uh university setting, particularly.

Marianna Bednarska 32:58

Yes, yes, especially when you go to the project, and in our case, there are not always all the instruments available, and there is a possibility, but um maybe someone says, Well, we have a problem with that, then you need to open a little bit some other doors in your head and maybe argue uh articulate another argument. So just to learn this this broader thinking about all of these aspects.

Announcer 33:24

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